The OP demanded opinions from the alumni of other NLUs as well.
I will still highly recommend the NUSRL students to not further this discussion just for the sake of criticising your batchmates where the same can be done in your college WhatsApp groups/personal groups.Keep it civil. Don’t share personal information as well or we will be forced to close this thread :)
We are taking each and every step to make sure that LI remains a relevant and healthy platform where people can discuss several updates and point out grievances. Any thread spreading misinformation or hatred will be strictly prohibited.
Kian is working extremely hard to maintain decorum in this website. Kindly acknowledge our request ❤️
Hey. I can tell you about arbitration. Start reading up every judgement on arbitration from today. While reading, when you see any cited judgement, read that one too until you fully understand what it deals with. Repeat everyday and you won't even realise how quickly you'll start developing an in depth understanding of the subject.
You can take assistance of articles but they can't substitute for judgements.
Noida might as well be rechristened Neo-Tokyo, mirroring not just the neon but the nihilism of its fictional counterpart in Katsuhiro Otomo's magnum opus, 'Akira.' The city's restless youth wander like rudderless rebels, channeling their inner Tetsuos and Kanedas but with a penchant for fisticuffs and profanity instead of psychic powers. Authority figures gaze upon this sprawling dystopia as if waiting for an Akira-level event to sweep it all away, their eyes filled with a blend of confusion and a yearning for lost order.
While the air quality doesn't exactly offer the olfactory delights of a nuclear winter, it does give the uninitiated a teasing whiff of post-apocalyptic perfume. Sure, the city streets may lack those iconic Akira-esque motorcycles, but that absence is more than compensated for by the parade of Cretas and Scorpios, each emblazoned with bumper stickers that scream individuality as loudly as a psychic blast from Tetsuo himself.
So, if you're scouting for a mini-dystopia that comes closest to Neo-Tokyo, look no further than this Trans-Yamuna civilization endearingly and sardonically dubbed "Neeoda." Trust me, it's as if Otomo sketched this urban labyrinth himself, but perhaps decided it was too realistic to include in his manga.
You made a good decision by choosing to work as an in-house counsel over being at the mercy of law firms where the work-life balance is in shambles. Since I don't know your exact work experience in "number of years," let me take a guess (approx 12-15 years), Maybe you can try to do an MBA from an IIM or a decent institute, and that degree coupled with your extensive experience in various companies as an in-house counsel will get you the perfect job. Many companies do hire Chief Legal Officers/GCs (that MBA degree might help). So that's my take. I hope this helps...
In the past, I witnessed a similar scenario play out. My sister, who conveniently had the hots for another girl—who also happened to be someone’s sister—was in quite the conundrum. After much internal debate and self-doubt, she turned to her ever-wise, perpetually-available, and supremely caring brother (yours truly) for advice on such heart matters. Embracing my role as the doting sibling, I reassured her that these things often have a way of sorting themselves out. Plus, since I knew the brother of the object of my sister's affection, I eagerly offered to facilitate a chat with her. A family and friends gathering provided the perfect backdrop for this talk. But, plot twist! As I approached her, it seemed she was also keen on striking up a conversation with me. We quickly found common ground: both of us were skeptical about Jim from 'The Office' (US version) being the knight-in-shining-armor he's made out to be. We agreed that 'Fight Club' might just be the best film adaptation (even trumping The Godfather) and debated the cryptic ending of '2001: A Space Odyssey.' But what took center stage was our mutual appreciation of my sister's sweetness, agreeing she deserved only the best. Thus began what can only be described as the most whirlwind and chaotic romance of the 21st century. It went strong... for a week. Then, both my sister and the brother of my week-long love interest (who, incidentally, was an old pal) discovered our liaison, leading to a family saga worthy of a prime-time soap opera. Suddenly, I was the villain! Can you imagine? My sister no longer speaks to her "loving" brother, my old friend acts like I'm invisible (claiming I exploited our friendship to woo his sister), and my fleeting flame? She's blocked me everywhere and conveniently relocated for her master's. Probably thinks I'm worse than Jim now.
So here I am, trying to make a living and watching life drift by, wondering... is "Fight Club" really that great?
Update with interviews for Assessment Centre? Also, The application page says the firm does not looking at applications on rolling basis, do we have to wait till the deadline passes for winter vacation scheme to hear back from the firm?
Absolutely! You can give clat next year. To make matter a bit more east , just try out this year’s clat as well. It will provide you insight and you are anyway eligible. Try to join the tier-1 nlus and so prepare well. Make newspaper reading a daily habit of yours and starting giving mocks. Watch some videos to get things started. All the best!
Today we will talk about ECBs – External Commercial Borrowings.
I remember the first time I was put on an ECB transaction, I was just told – go read up the ‘RBI Master Direction on External Commercial Borrowings, Trade Credits and Structured Obligations’. Like a diligent associate I went to the RBI website and downloaded the latest version of this RBI issued law. I mean how difficult could it be? I had to just read the Master Direction, see what law applies to our transaction and then discuss with my senior, right?
WRONG.
Loan Registration Number
Designated Authorised Dealer Category I Bank
FCY denominated ECB
MAMP
Hedging provision
All-in-cost ceiling – “… the swap cost plus spread should not be more than the floating rate plus the applicable spread …”
Wait, what were these technical terms I was reading? I had never come across these before. I was supposed to quickly read through the Master Direction and apply it in the transaction, but I couldn’t make any sense of the document. I couldn’t even understand what the Master Direction was about, let alone ask specific questions. This was a clear case of crash and burn where I had fallen face forward, and I felt completely helpless.
It took me some time to realise that this wasn’t a ‘me’ problem. Without having any background of economics or finance or prior experience, these documents wouldn’t make sense to anyone. At your law firm - as a quick fix - they might probably explain to you a specific item that needs to be inserted in the transaction document, but without understanding the context, that sense of cluelessness will linger on.
Ok Rohit, calm down. Don’t overthink this so much. Deep breaths in. You’ve got this.
So if we can’t figure out ECBs just by reading the Master Direction or a Mondaq article, what’s the solution? Alright, so I have an exercise for you which is going to give you some instant clarity. But you will have to follow the instructions carefully. Ready?
1. Go to your room and close all the doors and windows.
2. Plug in your Amazon electronics
3. Now shout out the following words: “Alexa – play the song ‘Paisa’ from De Dana Dan”
Done? Alright, let’s go:
Here’s the scenario: You have just got your first salary credited after slogging for 14 hours for a month. You have worked harder than ever before and now you deserve a treat. So you go partying at Bastian with your friends and treat yourself to some sushi at Izumi. You somehow manage to save INR 10, 000 from your salary. Now your parents want you to invest this INR 10,000 in a bank. You see that while SBI bank is offering a 4% return, Kotak is offering a 7% interest on fixed deposits. So you go with Kotak.
Now let’s take this one step forward. Banks don’t just make money out of thin air. If they are paying you interest at 7%, that’s because they take your money and lend it someone else at a higher interest rate to make profits. Let’s say the colleague sitting beside you in office had to avail an education loan to complete his college education. When he went to the bank for a INR 10 lakh loan, he noticed SBI offering education loan at 10%, while Kotak offering it at 15%. Obviously, he would choose the SBI loan as at a 10% interest rate on INR 10 lakhs, he would only have to repay just INR 1 lakh as interest, whereas a 15% rate would make the interest INR 1.5 lakh.
ECB works on a similar concept, but with one major difference - instead of shopping which bank to choose while borrowing, you select which country to take a loan from. See, ECB basically means –
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Money is flowing in FROM abroad INTO India.
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Different countries have different borrowing rates. Developed countries like US usually have 1-2% rate, while emerging markets like India have a borrowing rate of 7%. So, let’s say you’re the CEO of Adani Airport Holdings Limited, managing 7 airports across India. You want to now scale up the airport business for which you need almost $200 million. Instead of going to Indian banks, you go to Standard Chartered and Barclays bank in London to avail that loan as interest rates are lower and this will help save $5 million in interest. Since you will be upgrading the 7 airports in phases, you agree to DRAWDOWN/ use only $50 million this year, and avail the rest of the amount later (in TRANCHES). In your negotiations with the bank, you also tell the banks you should have an option to PREPAY the loan, in case something like Covid happens again and all business halts and there are no fliers coming to airports – meaning no revenue to repay the interest/ loan.
Let’s take another example you might come across deals – ON LENDING. You’re the head of an NBFC in India servicing low income families by extending credit to such people. Usually, such families don’t have any credit score, so the big banks don’t extend loans to them, and they end up taking loans at interest rate of 40% or more from loan sharks (Remember the ban on Chinese fintech apps?). Since the NBFC is anyway working with such low income families, you can’t charge a high rate of interest, but you still need to make a profit. In such a case, you can avail a loan of $200 million from a foreign government owned financial institution which is also involved in increasing credit access amongst masses and which charges interest at 4% per annum. Once you have this $200 million loan, you can use this amount to give multiple INR 50,000 loans to low income families trying to start their business at an interest rate of 5%.
You with me till here? Good.
Now here is where things get interesting. Whenever there is flow of money across Indian borders – be it in the form of FDI or even loans, there’s one entity which keeps a hawk-eye on such transactions – that’s the RBI. RBI and its bunch of minions (aka AD Banks) have created a complicated bunch of laws so they control every aspect of money inflow/outflow. Think of them as the local aunty who’s constantly spying on you:
1. Oh you want to avail a loan? – Go first get a Loan Registration Number (LRN) from us
2. Oh you want to avail a loan from Barclays UK? – we want to know each and every detail – Submit a Form ECB and tell us - who’s the lender, what’s the interest rate, what’s the end use, what’s the repayment period, what charges + processing fees are you paying, what ECB have you availed in the past?
3. Oh you changed your mind and now you want to repay it earlier? – submit another Form ECB (revised)
4. What’s the all-in-cost ceiling? (That’s basically the interest rate, processing and all hidden charges)
5. Which country is the lender/ borrower based in? Does it comply with international financial compliances we have agreed upon (ex – FATF/ IOSCO compliant country)
6. Oh you have been dating this foreigner guy and now you want to get married? You better have dated him for atleast 3 years. Oh wait, did you say he is doctor and has an income of $ 50 million? 1 year of dating is also fine.
Well, the last one isn’t exactly what RBI asks, but that’s MAMP in a nutshell (MAMP: minimum average maturity period) – the minimum amount of time the ECB loan has to be within India. MAMP is usually 3 years for ECBs, but there are carveouts to this general rule – it can be different basis who is the lender/ borrower/ what purpose etc. (Time to pick up that RBI Master Direction and give it a read)
Also, what are the “End use restrictions”? – that’s RBI telling you – you better not take loans to gamble away on betting on the housing market, stock market or some random stock your friend has been telling you about (remember how enthusiastic your friend was about Bitcoin changing the world?)
ROLE AS A LAWYER
As a lawyer, you’re involved in the documentation – let’s say between the Barclays Bank and Adani Airport Holdings. As a lawyer for the Indian borrower, we have to usually review the loan/ facility agreement to ensure all these stringent requirements set down by RBI are met, all necessary forms such as Form ECB are filed, draft security documents if some security is being given in India and obviously ensure that all CP and CS certificates are in place so that our Indian client can avail the loan quickly. ECB transactions also offer you the opportunity to interact with foreign counsels working for the lenders, and speak with the bank officials of the AD Bank. Depending on what the security structure is, and how many lenders are involved, the transaction structure will change, but this is the basics.
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Note: I have used loans to explain ECBs, but it can also involve bonds and other financial instruments.
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That’s ECBs – oversimplified for you. I obviously haven’t (and couldn’t) cover the entire framework. Also, you might have noticed we only covered ECBs, not the ‘Trade Credits and Structured Obligations’ bit of the RBI Master Direction. But I hope this post has given you some amount of clarity about what you’re working on and where your role as a lawyer fits in.
If you want more posts like this, comment “Paisa Paisa” in the comment box, and I will be back with more interesting posts.
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Your Dalal Street attorney,
XOXO
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Kya baat hai kya chiz hai paisa
Kya baat hai kya chiz hai paisa Ek baat mujhe batala de tu
The new Mods are doing a great job so far, but there are still concerns with upvoting and downvoting comments on this new website interface. Might want to try to fix that, if you can.
Have a hobby outside work which you are good at. This will ensure your confidence isn’t built on the work/ profession you do. Your self worth will be derived from more than just your day job. Humans crave feedback and appreciation so it doesn’t have to come only from you day job.
Also, speak to close friends about this. They may be going through the same issue and will be better abe to sympathise with you. Lawyers need a strong support system which can help them bounce back.
If it’s getting too bad, tolerate it till you have decent level of experience that you can switch to another place.
I'm currently only an A0 at a boutique IP firm, but was curious to know as to how does one become an Of-Counsel, how much do they get paid, what's the work like and how many years of experience do you need to become one?
HSF India group partners have been going around some of the top NLUs and JGLS advocating their new India internship programme which is apparently open to “all law students in India”. Is this programme any different from the traditional vacation scheme that they offer? Will they now truly be taking people from non NLUs? Will the procedure be any different from that of vacation schemes? Kindly elaborate
Thanks also to new mods for devoting time and making an effort to sustain this website for free exchange of information and inside secrets of the industry.
I started off my career with 11k at a cosmopolitan city and the money I was paid meant I did not have the financial capacity to take a bike on an EMI.
Fortunately, my brother agreed to give his Honda Activa to me and with that, I managed my daily commute.
I spent three months at my first office with a senior who expected me stay in the office from 9.30am to 8.30pm on the weekdays and upto anywhere between 3-4pm on weekends.
I quit in my fourth month and joined a law firm as I came from a law school. I was initially paid a paltry sum but within 2 years, I managed to find a job with a very good salary.
Litigation offices can have bossy people all around who give a damn to your personal and emotional well being.
The senior I worked with was a gentleman who worked more than I did and really took care of me like his younger brother. However, it was not me in time to spend the whole day in the office and yet think thrice to go attend a family's event at 8.30 pm, for that required me to walk upto the senior and ask for a permission to leave the office before he did. Leaving office before your senior does is frowned upon, but that is an established practice and here to stay.
If you intend to continue litigating, you need to forego quite a bit on the personal front in the first six to eight years of your practice.
If you can elaborate a bit about what you do like or don't like (such as writing, debating, speaking in public etc.), as well as any other strengths and weaknesses that you have, then it may be easier for people who are willing to help to do so. If it is a 3-Year LLB that you wish to do from Bengal, then try to do from Burdwan University or North Bengal University, instead of any local law college. While these are not great places, they have been offering the programme for long and do have some good alumni and faculty whom you can seek career advice from. If you can spare the fund to go outside Bengal, then DU is obviously the best possible choice. While studying, you can generally focus on examination-based career options, like judiciary examination or even the state/central civil services. Use your vacations to intern at smaller firms, who may be more amenable to accepting 3-Year law students as interns. You can also try to write the CLAT PG examination at the end of 3-Years, since some of the PSUs still shortlist for interviews based on that. Given that you have an UG degree in English, you can try your hands with content-writing during these 3-years to make some extra money. Hope this helps. I know a few people who have been in positions similar to you and the hardworking ones who could maintain focus have turned out to be quite successful by now. So, best of luck and chin up!
Requesting all my learned friends to come forward and share instances of insecure behaviour they have faced from partners. The idea is not to name and shame, but to serve as a ready guide for us gullible associates who operare with little to no information until it is too late. The other reason i want to start this converstion is to get sense of how common such behaviour is.
Please only share incident - not names as it will get moderated and defeat the purpose of this thread.
I was motivated to write this post, as I saw my immediate senior get passed over this year for promotion despite him being really good at what he does. My partner was really nice to him until he was a Counsel (he started his career with her) and then she started doing shady things like: (a) she wouldnt let him post legal updates etc on Linkedin or write articles/blogs without her being a co-author; (b) actively stopped him from getting staffed on matters with other partners or close supervision of managing partner; (c) she publicly berated him for not doing BD, but on the other hand would not give him any internal BD opportunities, claim prior relationship with anyone he proposed meeting, refused matters he sourced citing low fees and yet accepted similar matters at lower rates.
We are in a niche practice so its not like leaving for elsewhere is an immediate choice. Now I fear that same will happen to me - is my fear valid? Was this just an equation thing between her and my senior. Surely i wont be treated the way?
Hi! I am a fellow grad from a far flung university who made it into a corporate law firm. Switching careers is hard in the corporate world. If you are litigating, a close enough transition would probably be into law firms with a lit team (within the specific niche you are practicing in).
That being said, law in general pays poor. There are very few firms that pay decently and even then, the work life is massively screwed for anyone to establish even some semblance of a balance.
worked in GC for a year. As a new associate, lot of the work is conducting DD, verification of claims made by entities by scouring through VDRs and summarizing your findings. Work was repetitive for me in the first 2 months, since all your work has to be checked by your senior to ensure that they correct the mistakes you will inevitably make, so they tend to give you work that is easier to correct for someone with experience. The documentation is often voluminous, and confusing because there will be a lot of forms, reports, resolutions etc. that look similar but will have a minute difference which is what you're looking to point out, so reading that will take time and effort, at least initially.
Is it interesting? For me, yes and no. Yes because everything I did was new and something to learn, but the work itself isn't inherently interesting. When it starts to get diversified such as assisting on drafting SHA / SSA, research for issuance of legal opinion etc, it gets better.
I left the law firm to join a family member's practice but I wouldn't mind continuing in the firm tbh.
Buddy I am so sorry. I didn’t notice that you only wanted to go to law after ‘Woking for 2-3 years in the banking sector’. In that case , opt for exams like NLSAT. You can keep options of DU 3 year LLB as well/MHCET 3 year LLB.
Speaking about the prospects - I will say it’s not bad. You will be eligible for the SEBI Grade A legal manager exam. It will quench your thirst of banking sector a lot. You apply to several independent banking law firms as well. Start out with boutique firms. The legal insight will surely be an advantage in your CV and ofc for your competitive career as well. It will help you in your workplace as well! All the best!
They are not mad, you are just uninformed. A basic research will tell you, if dogs are removed from an area, the area will be repopulated with other dogs.
The solution to relocate them is embarrassingly ineffective and unoriginal and moreover, illegal. The dogs are aggressive because they are either in heat or hungry and regularly feeding them, neutering them and vaccinating them is the only viable long term solution and this responsibility falls upon the administration of a college not on animal rights activists.
The people wanting to get them relocated are just trying to illegally remove dogs and resort to a rather ineffective strategy. All the best to that.
In this thread I will pour out my thoughts (opinions) and experience (facts) of legal profession in General.
I am a 2020 grad from Tier -4/5 law school from a far flung no name Law school in a state. After my graduation, I immediately joined litigation. Needless to say, since our college was not so big, our only focus was Bank PO, SSC and other govt competitive exams. Me and my batch mates had no other plans. I tried a few exams then rested my pen. I joined litigation in 2021 under a senior lawyer in District court.
To my shock, juniors were not paid anything ANYWHERE in India regardless the forum, the senior advocates income and size of chamber. I continued to litigate as I had no other option. Meanwhile I came across few people from better Universities and they told me about Corporate Law Firms and how since I dont have any internships and because I am not from an NLU so I dont stand a chance at getting into them. Made me sad. I still message and reply to people working in law firm in hope of getting some guidance and break. But, I have dropped the hope.
Another issue with legal profession as also highlighted by CJI Sir recently is crazy work hours, be it inhouse, law firm or in litigation , litigation is the most toxic profession with crazy work hours. It really messes up family life. It sucks the soul out of your body and you really start to question your value as an individual and your reason to live. In other words, you hit existential crisis which often leads to undiagnosed high functioning depression.
You have an amusing argument. You think good faculty arrive on Earth from another planet - that's how all great institutions developed. On one hand, we live in a society (of UG students) that ridicules PG (LLM) and Ph.D. students, but on the other hand, everyone wants good faculty. Be the change you want you want to see, then talk.
It costs you nothing to give a hungry dog a Parle G biscuit and a drink of water. Yet you people would prefer that they starve. Then you complain when they get agitated.
Gandhi had said that you can judge the greatness of a civilisation by the way it treats its animals. Sorry to say, but by this metric NLUJ students (and other NLU dog-hating students) are brutes.
Please help Batch 2023 passout from t2 nlu still unemployed please do let me know what need to be done as i am unable to find job in Law firms( t2 and t3). Any advice how should i proceed with
Your answer still doesn’t provide any substantial evidence to support your conclusion of CAM’s retainer fee being the ‘lowest in the industry’.
We are happy to remove the ‘contested’ tag once we receive concrete information (this may be in any form possible be it authentic links or reports) from your side which can corroborate the conclusion.
Oi, be nice to the mods! Also, urdumb :) @(Tier-1 NLU) is literally correct: the original claim is hyperbolic, unless the industry only consists of 6 or 7 firms, there are approximately 572 Indian law firms that pay less than CAM (and probably one or two in the Big 7 also still pay less than CAM, depending on how you slice bonuses, fixed, etc?).
Champ be hopeful! If you are at a tier-1 then intern rigorously and publish to your fullest potential. No one can stop you from getting a job. Times have becomes tougher and murkier but you will sail through :)
Hi A0s who’ve been pushed into the B&F teams and are feeling lost. Welcome to this new phase in life.
Sometime back I was also an A0 working in the B&F practice and I was clueless.
I think there was huge gap in my learning because we were not taught this subject in college + B&F as a practice area is very technical + we didn’t having knowledge of financial valuations/ finance side of it + big law firms don’t give you time to absorb and learn - high volume of documents and too many deals happening)
Anyway, here’s me trying to give back to the community by making the transition easier for fresh graduates to your law firm job. We will start with an overview.
OVERVIEW:
So first question - What the hell is banking finance?
Banking & Finance - especially on the Corp side - mostly deals with debentures and loan agreements + security docs. There’s also bit of insolvency, and then some other complicated securitisation and financings. We’ll come to that later.
For now just remember these 3 terms - the bread and butter of most law firms:
NCDs, ECB, ODI financing
Alright, now let’s break it down further. Let’s focus on the basics - 1. Loans & 2. Debentures
Loans
You must have heard of a car loan.
A person goes to the bank. Takes a loan to buy a car. He gives some collateral/ security to the bank in case he defaults in paying back the loan - the collateral can be the car, or some gold deposits in his bank etc.
In law firms, we don’t deal with this. We deal with bigger matters but it’s the same concept. So let’s say a big company like Tata Motors goes to a bank/ NBFC to take a 100 cr loan because it wants to buy the company Jaguar.
Okay, so where do law firms come in? In our earlier example, for the car loan - usually these loan documents are standard documents and the person taking the loan has to just sign the bank document. But let’s say Tata Motors is taking a 100 cr loan. It won’t just sign a standard contract. It will want a tailor-made document for itself so it can save on interest payment/ tax/ have longer repayment period etc. This is where Law firms come in. We draft the loan agreement and the security document basis the commercials agreed between Tata Motors and the bank. We also try to negotiate with the bank so we can get favourable terms for our client.
Wait, what’s a security document? Do you mean like a gold deposit? Well no. This is where your college education might help a bit. Remember learning about the difference between pledge, hypothecation, mortgage in college? Now you get to see these documents in their full fledged glory.
Security documents generally include:
1. Pledge agreements - shares of the borrower/ subsidiary may be pledged as collateral. Let’s say Tata Motors bought some shares in the company Tata Neu. They might pledge those shares of Tata Neu to get a loan from SBI. 2. Hypothecation - Tata Motors has some inventory of cars in its factory/outlet and some regular cash flow from selling these cars. Charge is created on these cars or cash flow in favour of the bank. 3. Mortgage documents - Let’s say Tata Motors just bought a 100 acre land to maybe construct a factory. They hand over the title docs of this property to the bank as collateral (hmm.. which out of the 5 types of mortgage is this?)
There are also other documents often used - non disposal undertakings (aka - don’t you dare sell those shares); trustee agreements (aka - let the trustee handle it, we lenders don’t have so much time); inter creditor agreements (aka - fight club of lenders); escrow agreement (aka - I don’t trust you with the money, so I’m gonna put it with a third party bank account) etc. Anyway, let’s not lose our head over these, backs to basics -
Now depending on the reason the loan is being availed (end use of the loan), your transaction maybe classified as - project finance, acquisition finance, real estate financing. Wait what’s that?
Acquisition finance -
End use: want to acquire another entity
Ex: Flipkart wants to buy Myntra but doesn’t have the money. So it goes to SBI to get 200 cr loan to buy Myntra. Flipkart knows it can repay the loan over 20 years using profits generated from Myntra.
Real estate finance:
End use: build real estate projects / housing
Sobha group wants to build 10 high end condominiums in Whitefield with each unit having a private garden and pool. Say the cost of this is 5cr each unit * 10 units = Project cost 50 cr
So they borrow 60 cr from the ICICI bank, to fund this project. They know that all the millionaires in Whitefield will easily pay 9cr for their properties located in such a prestigious location.
But wait, why borrow 60cr and not 50 cr? Cos it will take them 5-6 years to build the project and during that time, they will also have to pay interest on the loan taken (no income for 5 years as the house isn’t built yet). So although they need 50 cr, they will also need buffer for interest payments.
After 5 years, let’s say all 10 units are sold out for 9cr after launch. So they will have a neat revenue of 9cr * 10 units = 90 cr.
They pay back the bank probably 60 cr and 6 cr interest over a 5 year period, and pocket the rest 90-66 cr = 34 cr as profit.
Project finance:
End use: build projects for which cash flows will only come after extended periods of time.
Example: Constructing the Bandra Worli Sealink. It takes more time than to build residential houses, also you can’t upfront sell the bridge like a house and recover the cost in this case.
Project financing is actually quite interesting and easier to understand when you understand the finance side also.
Disclaimer for A0s - I have over simplified this a bit for your understanding. While all this sounds interesting, you’re job initially will be grunt work - proof reading documents, fixing the cross references, maintaining CP checklists, losing your head in tracking emails, taking notes on calls etc. Life will get chaotic at times.
Don’t lose hope. Try to learn quickly so seniors can trust you with meatier work. Things should get better.
If you want a part 2, where I discuss ECBs (oversimplified), do comment a “Part 2” in the comments so that more people can see this post, and I’ll be back with more interesting posts.
Life's a battlefield, and right now, you're standing at a critical juncture. Your love interest has taken a different path, charting a new course by switching colleges. It's a reminder that we're all captains of our own destinies. Now it's your turn to seize the helm of your own ship, and here's how I think you should go about it.
First and foremost, let go. Inhale forgiveness and exhale the past. Your former flame made a choice, and so must you. Your focus, my young friend, should be on cracking the life code we call financial independence. Money may not buy happiness, but it offers the freedom to find it on your own terms. You're on the cusp of your final year; it's the perfect moment to hone your skills to a razor-sharp edge, priming yourself to be a force to be reckoned with in your chosen field.
Brace yourself; the industry you're stepping into won't offer you a gentle landing. As a newcomer, you may often feel like you're drowning in a sea of expectations, your capabilities always a notch below what's asked of you. It's a high-stakes arena, and the last thing you need is to get caught in the clutches of your own anxiety. Trust me, in these moments of struggle, the fleeting romantic escapades of the past won't come galloping to your rescue.
In your journey, you'll undoubtedly cross paths with a variety of characters—some genuinely a treasure, but many could very well be the devil incarnate. Navigate with discernment; know when to extend your hand and when to draw your sword. Keep your eyes open, but more importantly, wear your game face. Treasure the comrades who will brave the coming tempests alongside you, for they are your true North Stars.
So, my warrior of life, step into the arena with fire in your belly and thunder in your voice. Take your cue from Nolan's cinematic wisdom: "Rage, rage against the dying of the light." Unfurl your battle cry and march forward, for this, my dear, is your time to shine.
Not plagiarised but it seeems that there were disagreements within the faculty too. Basically the students convened a general body meeting which dissolved all committees. So there is no functioning Moot Court Society. So admin got a chance to take over, to “encourage more participation”. One of the faculty advisors argued that encouraging participation is fine but the univ rounds also should have a clear standard in terms of depth; participation can be encouraged through novice moots, making moots as part of continuing evaluations etc also. That faculty advisor also had a detailed problem ready but that was not accepted by the admin. So now it is a question of whether a single-issue problem with at least basic materials easily accessible (including some not-great memorials) can have sufficient depth. And whether the admin should be running this at all instead of the student body.
1. though everyone please try to tone it down and de-escalate a little, as much fun as it is to bash each others' law schools :) Criticism is fine, but please don't go overboard and keep harping on the same points, like NLU Delhi fudging figures in NIRF, or NUJS + Mamata = evil, or XNLU being awful, or whatever. Please stick to factual criticism, rather than just opinions, if possible.
2. Genuine request: please tone down politics talk in general. The vast majority of readers and commenters will ultimately not benefit or enjoy if LI turns into an SJW crusader platform, or full of incessant Modi or Raga bashing, or everyone's favourite unwoke WhatsApp uncle foaming at the mouth and railing against the evil Wokes being the end of modern civilisation. There are enough platforms for all this left vs right culture war nonsense and fake news, so if this is important to you, please seek those out rather than LI - there should be plenty of other interesting things for educated lawyers to talk about.
Hi Kian! Thanks for adding new moderators. Hopefully this increases the speed of moderation. I was curious if the selected users will still be able to contribute to a thread if they want to (under their own username) or will their duties solely revolve around moderating the threads?
Also, if there is a need for more moderators, would be happy to help! Have received quite some valuable feedbacks from this forum and would definitely love to give back to the community.
Due to popular long-running demand and dissatisfaction with the speed of our moderation, we have mixed and opened things up a little as an experiment.
Many thanks to @AshReh, @TheLord, @(Tier-1 NLU), @TroubledLawyer and @waqeel (in alphabetical order), for volunteering in this recent threadfor the (hopefully not) thankless and tough task of mainting a semblance of decorum on LI 🎉
And if others are interested in volunteering, please let us know in this thread (after having signed up anonymously with your username) - we will likely be shuffling the numbers of moderators around in the coming weeks to find a team that gels well. In the meantime, due to the moderation system, posts will likely get published faster but may sometimes also get unpublished or also get locked for a while.
Good luck, god speed and ❤️! Please let us know how it goes 🧿
Read FEMA regulations and rules and notifications and circulars available on RBI website first. Thats your key. Many CAs / CSs have videos on youtube teaching FEMA. You can find lot of such reading material on websites of such CAs. Read anything available online and look for the relevant regs and cross link it and understand. This way you'll know what you read is actually the law.
Reading of commentaries on FEMA will also help. It's an ocean so be ready for a long journey.
Remember one key thing
Current A/c Transaction - everything is allowed unless specifically prohibited
Capital A/c Transaction - everything is prohibited unless specifically allowed.
Hi. Does the firm get to know when you buy a stock? I'm not insider trading or anything. The value of the shares I'm considering purchasing is very small as well. The process to seek approval seems too cumbersome that's all. Is there any way that the firm can directly access our DMAT details from any depository?
Dear Gobar (hereinafter referred to as "Not-Your-Real-Name"),
Greetings from the land of green rookies and life's perpetual students. I trust this missive finds you luxuriating in Bhopal's embrace. You see, as my freshly minted degree attests, I'm still a novice navigating this thing called life. Now, you may be told by well-meaning, glassy-eyed optimists that "everything will be okay." Such a phrase, I find, translates almost perfectly into "Not-Your-Real-Name."
That 'cream of the corporate' you seek is nothing but a cheap lubricant that your eventual boss/partner/senior/client is eagerly waiting to liberally apply on you (or yours) for every misstep and blunder you make in your romantic ballet of errors. But fret not! Over time, this grotesque lubrication might just become your brand of moisturizer. You'll grow accustomed to its slick sheen, perhaps even find a perverse sort of enjoyment in it. Soon enough, you'll be brandishing your workaholism like a badge of minor honor before your non-lawyerly acquaintances. "Behold," you'll declare, "how thoroughly I've acclimated to my pitiable yet oddly comforting grind!"
As for your feelings of unbelonging at NILU Bhopal, let me offer a modicum of hard-earned wisdom: Rush not toward judgment. The existential boat you find yourself on—be it a yacht, a dinghy, or a rusting submarine—will in due course reveal the fundamental pointlessness or, dare I say, the dizzying complexity of everything and nothing. And perhaps, just perhaps, that will become the cosmic joke you needed all along.
KLE is a great college; however, it is affiliated with KSLU. I don't study at KLE myself, but being under KSLU, I can attest to its terrible reputation. The exams are fairly easy, and the syllabus is quite good. The syllabus, along with the way exams are structured, expects you to thoroughly understand the law. Additionally, KSLU places significant emphasis on learning the practicalities of the law. A substantial part of the syllabus comprises practical training subjects such as ADR, moot courts, internships, and court visits. Students are expected to shadow advocates, maintain diaries of their work at law offices, keep a court diary, and have a case diary (where they follow a specific case, attend hearings, and record arguments and such). KSLU has a strong focus on litigation.
The problem with KSLU is that they do not carefully evaluate your answers. Evaluation at KSLU is subpar, and not many students pass on their first attempt. In fact, the pass percentage is so low that no student expects to clear all their papers in one go. However, most students who initially fail end up passing after re-evaluation. It's not impossible, and many students do pass all their papers in the first attempt, but succeeding requires much more than just writing well. Moreover, since it's a state university, there are administrative issues to deal with such as delays in announcing exam dates, making it challenging to plan internships.
This is not meant to discourage you. Students at universities affiliated with KSLU are still succeeding. You just need to put in a bit more effort compared to NLU students. NLS is a great option if you can afford it, but remember that their 3-year program is new (only in its second year). You're better off choosing a college with a strong alumni network and a well-established program. Just ensure that whatever college you choose has excellent administration and a robust support system. KSLU is already challenging to deal with, so don't add a bad college to the mix.
SH will depend on consent at the time of the event, which was absent in this case. Not on whether the victim chooses not to remain traumatised about it for the rest of their lives.
To add more context, here’s the law firm play book -
- attract naive college kids with a 1 lakh package - sounds a lot but when you start living on your own in big cities, you realise it’s not a that much.
- dazzle them with fancy offices, idea of prestige of working at a big brand, working with big companies etc but make them to do clerical work so their exit opportunities are hampered
- create a sense of fear and create a competitive environment where everyone is competing for limited spots and now colleagues won’t hesitate to backstab each other
- tell them how there is serious competition in the market where everyone is undercutting each other fees so they have to work harder (read: work till 4am in the morning and say bye bye to weekends)
- make them work late nights for such long periods, they are now in sleep deprivation mode where their cognitive ability to take rational balanced decisions slowly fades away and they are okay indulging in petty office activities
- make them so tired and exhausted, all lawyers want at the end of the week is a quick relief - where they end up getting hooked to ordering fancy food during late nights(thinking heys it’s on client tab so why not), drinking expensive wine and now they can’t leave the profession cos a normal job won’t financially sustain their self destructive habits
So at the end of the day, (in the initial years) you have mostly due diligence experience with limited exposure to drafting/ negotiation of the main documents and your exit opportunities are seriously hampered. You think to yourself - you can’t go anywhere outside the limited circle, and you’re getting paid decent, so you tell yourself better to stick to the hellhole for a bit longer and not think about the future now.
Disclaimer: This is a slightly pessimistic view on law firms. Obviously not every team is like this. Some teams have better culture, and usually in smaller teams partners care more about their associates and have a healthy humane interaction with their juniors. But basis the way most big law firms are structured and function (massive team sizes), most partners/ seniors don’t have an incentive to be humane considering the insane work load, long hours and competition within law firms.
Being robbed at knife-point – or in my rather unique case, screwdriver-point – is an experience few can boast of, and even fewer would want to. On one not-so-magical night, while attempting to return from a day spent jousting in the courts, I vividly recall my encounter with Bombay's infamous 'gardullas' as I made my way back from a tiring session of courtly endeavors to my modest sanctuary in 'Nalla Sopara'. I was nestled in the bosom of my beloved first-class compartment, which on that particular evening, was suspiciously empty. Most days, these coaches are so full they seem on the brink of a dramatic explosion. But that night? It was like attending a funeral for an unpopular relative – eerily quiet and no one you’d recognize.
The hour was encroaching upon the witching time, and the lack of the usual hustle in the coach made my spider-senses twitch. As the train trundled into Mira Road station, I spied a motley crew of gentlemen who looked as if they'd been rehearsing for a heist scene in a B-grade movie. Their poised readiness to board felt like I had an audience awaiting my next move. Trusting my instincts, I sprang to my feet and hastily disembarked, seeking refuge in the adjacent, reasonably populated general compartment.
The universe seemed to smile as I snagged a window seat. Across from me sat three seemingly worn-out souls, whom I mused were just returning from their 9 to 9 grind. Yet, just as I began crafting a heartfelt narrative about these diligent men, Naigaon approached and the plot twisted. One began a loving dance with my wristwatch, another serenaded my phone into his pocket, and the pièce de résistance? The third presented his rusty screwdriver, perhaps thinking I needed a bit of DIY in my life. Their ballet of theft was so swift, it deserved a standing ovation.
As they exited stage left with grace and alacrity, I was left, not with anger, but with an appreciation for their flair. There I was, amidst an audience of weary travelers, pondering the artistry of my own personal pocket-theatre, staged by hardworking men in search of a different kind of payday.
Focus on your grades, and pick a subject to develop expertise(whether new or old, doesn't matter, all practice areas money at different times in the cycle ).
But more importantly, travel, read novels and everything else under the sun, do some sport or gym, get high, laugh and cry with your friends, pick a hobby and explore yourself, because once gone, college life doesn't happen again.
You'll be enough, you'll do good, you'll make your parents proud.
He worries before his time, worries twice. - maybe seneca
Lol, name one professor in commercial or company law in India that produces as fantastic research as BS Chimni or Upendra Baxi and the like? It is not that the non-commercial law professors (coming to human rights point in a bit) have a strong lobby, it is that law firm partners and senior advocates produce really shoddy pieces in the name of research which would never fly in a top journal. Their academic merit is seriously questionable. This is unlike places like US, Europe, Singapore etc. where commercial law people, including judges regularly publish in top journals - something that is unimaginable in India. Just look at big law firm people publishing in Harvard Law Review and the like - ask a law firm associate to write something for it and they will shit their pants.
Now, coming to the 'influential lobby of HUMAN RIGHTS professors' point. The fact that you created a dichotomy of commercial law and human rights is telling, right? How corporate law produces inequality and hierarchy is something you will not get by reading tech law or finance law. There is no human rights vs. commercial law, there is only human rights AND commercial law; they are not mutually exclusive, unlike your spurious dichotomy might suggest. So, you have to come out of your tiny hole.
If you are so concerned about the funding - where is the private sector funding? Why do law firms not fund chairs which pay so much that Cyril bhai wants to become a professor? Non-commercial law professors are less motivated by money than commercial law people (otherwise they would have opted for other careers), so let the law firms and big tech companies establish exceptionally well-paid chair professorships. Perhaps even the great commercial law professors in institutions abroad might want to come and work in India. Would work well for everyone involved, including the students, university, teachers and the country as a whole.
First of all, as per WHO bacteria in food gets killed at around 65℃. So if food is cooked in this temperature it will not contain bacteria. So the question to ask is whether the food was cooked at this temperature. The answer seems to be yes. Also, we haven't heard of any huge outbreak of stomach bacterial infection.
Secondly, if you think it's gross to eat food touched by human feet, then you should google and see in what unhygienic conditions chicken is prepared. The hens poop in their cages and eat the poop. See this article by PETA, which says that you are literally eating bird poop when you eat chicken.
In addition to the KCO YT Channel, you can read up on the same from the websites of firms like NDA (they recently did a trend analysis and the material is really concise, although not as expansive for obvious reasons. The KCO YT channel wins here, but the NDA material is a good start).
If you are looking into FEMA/ODI, the articles on the website of Resolut works as well. You can also refer to blogs like Mondaq. They have a rich collection authored by various law firms.
Hello. Try pushing your masters in the US. They genuinely have a good demand of legal services in agencies like NASA and SpaceX. You can pursue the Harvard/Yale LLM and if you are excellent then maybe lateral you have a shot. If you are serious about your space law passion , then a JD will be better. Gain experience and start applying.
That decision does not lie with NLS but with Karnataka Govt. This has been discussed in another thread. If the Karnataka government does not "let go" of NLS as a state institution with a formal NOC, it is not going to happen. States not letting go of their institutions is not new. WB Govt did not give the NOC to Jadavpur U in 2005 when there was a proposal to make it into an IIT. Once the state government does not give NOC, the central government moves on. Jadavpur is still a state institution. Under the current scenario, the relationship between the Centre and the Karnataka Govt is not at all amicable - Karnataka just scrapped the NEP. Plus don't underestimate the importance of state domicile reservation for Karnataka Govt.
It has been around 5 years since I joined the profession. Currently I'm working at a mid-tier law firm which pays me around 24 LPA including the bonus component. My team isn't toxic and partner is a very kind person who passes on his experience and knowledge. I usually get free by 8:30 (starts around 10:30) and in a city like Mumbai it takes me around 45 mins to reach home. At times, even the Saturdays are off.
I am wondering if I'll move to a Tier 1 firm, what could be my salary expectations and work timings?
One of those few precious replies. I had not elaborated on my answer but if there was one, this is it! Thanks for taking the time out.
Also when I said that an IIM A should do fine, it was purely out of financial concerns. I'm not actually comparing M7 with Indian B Schools. Also the main question I don't think is answered here is:
Is OP doing an MBA purely for the money bracket, and if yes, a money bracket with respect to where? From my understanding, if OP intended to settle outside India, the choices would have become way easier. While it is true that global has the potential to become local any day, it is also true that the packages that are bagged by IIM ABC grads are mostly top-notch with very little wiggle room (pardon me if there are instances that prove otherwise. Not aware of the same). In this light, IIM A just makes more sense economically.
Go to any conveniently located 3-year college in Bangalore, start practice and forget about the whole "NLSIU 5yr v 3 yr v Jindal v NUJS" crap. Do your best and then focus on your clients and the profession will reward you even if the trolls snicker. Unless you have a golden family entry ticket, law requires and invites you to make your own way. Get in somewhere, do your work, and serve your clients faithfully, you'll be perfectly happy in life.
The original post and several of the follow up replies that support the proposition, are fundamentally erroneous. Mere hours that an associate spends on a matter is not correspondent to the billing the firm receives from a client. The associate is involved in execution. That's it. The real brains and creativity and energy - this is what the client pays for btw - is of the partner. The associate is not the one who counsels the client's promoters, meets/speaks to them on Saturdays and Sundays, devises the strategy for the entire transaction keeping in mind the promoter's many other needs and issues. I can get my steno of 30 years to do the same thing that the associate does and he/she will do it far better. Any associate who truly has a brain will understand rule number 1 - never try and assume the genius and success of your senior as your own. You have merely played a role in executing a matter. That's it. This has been my guiding philosophy from the time I was a junior, which is why I have now reached where I have.
Kindly requesting you all to respect the privacy of our dearest friend Urvi, and her family at this tough and trying time. I am writing this email on behalf of her closest friends, and we know that Urvi has taken this unfortunate step due to very personal reasons and has nothing to do with the college administration. While we understand that the meeting at the auditorium yesterday might have ignited some anger among the student body, kindly understand that at this point the University administration has more important issues to take care of. They are all working to ensure that her family and her friends are taken care of at this hour, and that is definitely the biggest priority. Any issues on condemning a speech can wait for later. We are now solely and only concerned with how her near and dear are. Kindly refrain from reposting any messages of condemnation at least for the initial few weeks so that her family can deal with the grief in a personal matter and not have it made into a politicised conversation and let them grieve in peace. Additionally refrain from starting any threads or conversations regarding this on social media platforms for now, regarding the administration’s stand or her to ensure that her privacy is not violated in the process. She was someone who hated to have her name thrown out and about in any manner. Please adhere to this to respect her late soul. May her rest in peace.
I do support the advice you gave, and with the second paragraph in general.
Mere do paise on this:
1. The top tier firm law partners who are non-NLU were so before NLUs become relevant. If you were to judge based on that criteria alone in today's time, we still have T1,2 and 3 NLUs, where the lowest rung NLUs suffer just as much as outlier colleges.
2. Litigation has always been dominated by state unis for the same reason. Also, the kind of money that is spent in NLUs to obtain the degree, it is generally hard for the NLU grad to shift to litigation with its low paying culture and survive for a significant amount of time before the dice starts rolling.
3. Regarding rigour of NLUs, this is something that most state unis do not get. Your courses are tougher than ours, with dozens of research papers, assignments, moots, paper presentations, seminars and what not.
[I guess] the point that OP is trying to make is that even after doing everything you said in the second paragraph (and as someone who has personally done that to separate myself from the crowd at my state uni), there are still biased notions that are held on by most law firms (not referring to tiers here). Its not like they are not insurmountable, they just require a lot more time than what someone else starting further from the starting line would need. On top of that (as far as LI threads have reported) there is also this particular habit of tiered law firms to discount the years of experience when laterally shifting for better pay and for obvious ambition.
Big dogs are sniffing for the wrong things is what we mean mostly. Am I equivalent to the top crop of NLUs? Probably not. But a lot of students from NLUs who do get hired sometimes do a shabbier job than a big bunch of us and that is where the systemic problem lies.
I was an A0 and I made the silliest mistakes. My seniors never shouted at me. Instead they understood and took the time to explain/ show how it is done. I may have been scolded, but not screamed at where I felt like I was being put down.
Some people let power and money get to the head. There’s no excuse be that pathetic. I hope you break the cycle and treat your juniors better.
Actionable advice - if everyone around you is acting as if this normal, stay there for 6 months and try to learn as much as possible and start looking for another job soon.
You’re from SCAM. You already have good brand value. There are enough jobs in the market. Start following recruiters on LinkedIn who keep posting vacancies - Vahura, Adept, Avimukta
You’ll realise your boss doesn’t have that much power over you as you might think he/ she has.
Just so you know - what you are feeling is valid and lot of us have gone through this. Just to add more context and give you a more proper answer:
First year at a T1 is extremely chaotic. Because you’re suddenly thrown into this fast paced culture which is very different from college. Also, since you’re learning different processes - not just law, but things which aren’t written anywhere (internal law firm workflow/ how courts work/ which senior has what style of working - what he/ she likes dislikes), this just takes up a lot of your time.
Since this isn’t exactly billable work or work in the traditional sense where you are completing a project, you may not realise it, but this is also a groundwork which you need to put in to get a foothold.
Also, from some seniors there is sometimes an expectation that - this person is a junior at beginning of career. They know nothing, so they should sacrifice everything else to learn and make their career. We have slogged and so should they. At times, you might feel like you’re dancing to the tune of your senior (I hope you have reasonable seniors).
And it is partly true. You’re at the beginning of your career. When you’re going from 0 to 1, that extra effort will be required. Think of it this way - you’re building your credibility at this stage where people are monitoring you and trying to form an opinion about you - is he/ she a trustworthy candidate who can take ownership of work. So you need to put in that extra effort.
This is not to say that you should give up all your hobbies. Trust me, only focusing on work - that will drive you crazy. (Been there done that - ended up depressed)
But yes, getting time to read will be difficult. Also since you’ll be cramming yourself with judgements at work, your mind will be constantly overloaded and your mind will crave an instant relief - on weekends automatically you will want to sleep/ do something more dynamic like going out/ watching a movie etc.
But over time you’ll need to draw boundaries at your workplace. Casually discuss with your team members maybe that you like doing/ you have certain hobbies. (Reasonable bosses realise their associates need to recharge) Also, as previously mentioned - reading in the morning when work chaos hasn’t started - that’s a good time to try out (again depends on how your team works/ what time your boss emails you)
Again, these are only generic advice. The specific advice will depend on your specific circumstances. I hope you find your peace and your time to pursue your hobbies. Because as someone once said:
“
Medicine, law, business, engineering, these are all noble pursuits, and necessary to sustain life. But poetry, beauty, romance, love, these are what we stay alive for.
What if you get a partial ride with fellowship in M7>T15>Europe MBAs. These days these types of fellowships are not uncommon as I mentioned earlier. It just depends on your affordability.
And even if you don't get a scholarship working abroad(in top cities in the west) for 5yrs isn't a bad option, but it is not for everyone.
It would also be worth factoring non financial aspects like staying away from family, working in a new culture, adjusting in a new environment also.
Let's take an example, there is one Private Equity opening in Mumbai 2 candidates with identical soft and hard skills. One is from Booth other is from IIM A. Booth MBA is the clear win. There would be 50 other IIM A candidates the firm would have encountered, but a Booth Candidate clearly sets himself apart from all other candidates.
Talking about Indian Big Shots being from IIM A it's mainly because those Indians who go abroad for a top MBA stay abroad and become biggies abroad in global HQs and he will be superior to the Indian IIM Biggies [lots of famous cases]. (99% of the time). Not that a top foreign MBA can't become a biggie in India, for all you know he will become a biggie faster.
But if you are a person short of funds, if you don't have any goals of immediately working abroad for next 5+yrs simply stick to an Indian B School.
Today many senior professionals I spoke with consider an Indian MBA( which is not an MBA in most of the cases) as an Insult even though they get high salaries. Mostly youngsters fresh out of Grad school with negligible experience and skills get into to IIM ABC after a CAT lottery.
What I want to say is Global can any day become local, but a local can't be global anyday. ( deliberately wrote it wrong grammatically).
Ask yourself a few more questions where would a top millionaire, billionaire, industrialist or a top corporate tycoon send his children for an MBA? Even though his company including senior management will be filled with IIM grads.
Why did Indira Nooyi pick Yale? Why is she critical about Indian B Schools?
No offense to IIMs, they have the geographic advantage. But the world is much bigger than IIM ABC. There are much better options.
There are much better work locations apart from Mumbai Bangalore and Gurgaon.
I set aside a specific hour every day for reading, just like sleep. I switch my phone off during that period. So far, it has worked in the last five years while working in a firm.
I switched from In-house to tier-2 which is so worse. i suggest you join in house, it will save you lot of anxiety and stress. life is all about balance. Kaam kbhi khtam nhi hoga. In house mein khush rahogey.
Honestly, I love reading books too, but I did not read or paint for more than a year due to work. It made me very frustrated. Now I have started reading at least 30-50 pages daily. The most suitable time for me is early in the morning when I am having my coffee or when I'm in bed. I make it a point to read something before sleeping. It can be even two pages or one paragraph. But read.
For office use indoors, stick to freshie scents. The Aqua Di Gio by Armani is a good safe buy. Others include Isse Miyake and Versace. Gucci and Burberry also make decent fragrances that won't turn heads, but will keep you smelling fresh.
For client meetings, it's best to smell expensive but restrained. Get a Dior Fahrenheit or a Prada Luna Rossa range.
For when you're socialising, you want to project but not suffocate. Consider a louder perfume like the Sauvage EDT, YSL Y or the Azzaro Wanted lineup.
If you're on a budget, stick to Zara's lineup which are all clones of popular expensive perfumes with scaled down performance. The Seoul is a good all day use frag.
If you're not on a budget, step into the world of Tom Ford, Versace Atelier etc.
You question deserve merit and need to be answered. As a trans person I would say EWS, SC/ST/OBC are the categories so is the transgender. There are various report documenting their backwardness. In determination of reservation of seats, it is the extensive documentary proof with regard to particular distinctive group which matter.
Transgenders suffer violence and discrimination because of their non-conformity and their distinctive gender/sex identity, they suffer discrimination solely on the ground of their gender-identity and they are often prohibited from entering many places this is why there is provision for them in Transgender Persons Act, 2019 i.e., denial of the right of passage in public place. They suffer from the curse of untouchability. Their mother and father abandon them from the time of birth. While coming out they suffer from assault and threat to their life from their own family member. They are killed solely on the ground of their gender/sex identity. They are aborted due to their sexual mark. They are subjected to surgery without their consent from their birth. They often drop out from school and run away from their abusive home. They often resort to prostitution and begging. They suffer isolation and a sense of abandonment from their family member. They fear from public so enrolled themselves in distance education.
What more do you need to know? Have you seen anyone suffer from such severe kind of disabilities. Does EWS/SC/ST/OBC face untouchability, abandonment, threat to their life from their own family, denial of the right of passage. The Transgender community does not hold political power due to their extreme backwardness.
Now I have myself wrote to the Chief Minister of Delhi to register one seat for me in NLUD by issuing a Government Order in the memory of supreme sacrifice of Sahibzada Baba Zorawar Singh and Sahibzada Baba Fateh Singh so as to pay homage to the sons who fought for the faith of the motherland.
I am seeking reservation on the basis of exemplary achievement in the field of social work through the agency of law and Constitution of India.
I cannot get in NLUD from AILET -2024, and now my fate lies with the Atishi Singh Education Minister of NCT of Delhi.
I'm an A1 at a T1 Disputes Team. I really love reading books. However, as a busy professional, I'm finding it challenging to find time and diversify my reading habit across various genres. To everyone over here, who also love to read, I would appreciate any advice or insights on how you manage to make time for reading amidst demanding full-time jobs. Thank you!
Here are a couple of reasons why you may not have been hired.
1. The vacancy ceased to exist. The firm decided to promote someone internally and not take the risk of hiring someone else and test waters and eventually arrive at a culture shock.
2. The firm opted for someone who had more PQE than you and that trumped your candidature.
3. If it was a client transaction that had drove the decision to hire, maybe things did not work out with the client and hence the aftermath?
State University is always a thing. You will make it big in your career if you keep at it but it takes time and a lot more effort than what others needed. This is in addition to discounting your years of experience when you join a tier 1 law firm and all the BS like that.
For all those who ask "Why did you not retake CLAT?" Let's lay the tables, shall we?
i. Paisa baby. Not everyone of us is born in the lush comfort of Rupee bills.
ii. We may have older parents whom we can't leave behind.
iii. In addition to both, some people just are not comfortable moving out. Yes, they choose to remain inside their shells or well, just like you throw a spear of an absolutely unwarranted and unrelated question everytime someone talks about the hardships faced by state university student.
I am an Ex- law aspirant and I have transitioned into the field of Finance. I would say:-
Booth>Yale>IIM A.
Also, M7>T15>Top European MBA>IIM ABC> Other Tier 1 B Schools in India.
This is a no brainer. What you choose depends on what you can afford... A Ferrari is better than a BMW, it's a fact but what can you afford?
In all the top US B Schools Scholarships and Fellowships are generous( 30-90% of the class). So if you have scholarship anywhere north of 50% simply go, get a part time job, do whatever you want but go.
If you get a scholarship below 50% go but be aware that to repay such loans you have to work in top cities of the world for 5yrs atleast.
The diversity in top us b schools is excellent. You will come across a few ex MBB Engagement Managers, Ex IB VPs etc.
Coming back to India, even an IIM recruiter will prefer a top foreign MBA over an Indian MBA keeping all other things like performance and skills equal.
This is because MBA is pursued for a brand and not for skill, for skills you have zillions of rigorous in depth professional programmes. And there won't be a reason why one MBA guy would be preferred over another, if it was not for a brand.
Ask yourself the following questions:- Why do IIM ABC students compete like barbarians to get a simple student exchange? Why do IIM ABC grads pursue a 2nd MBA abroad after 5 plus yrs or work experience? Why do top Indian B Schools prefer foreign educated faculty?
No ifs and buts we are still in colonial hangover.
An IIM MBA is not even an MBA in India and abroad. It is more of a PGP or MiM.
Top executives abroad itself ,are critical about Indian MBAs.
Getting into a top B School in India is more of a gamble.
That being said you won't find New York level compensations in Gurgaon.
Your progress depends more on your performance.
But a foreign MBA offers more prestige and options.
Apart from Khaitan, CAM, S&R and LawNK, no other famous firms have a de facto one-internship policy. So, if you're looking for PPOs on the basis of one internship, it is crucial to question the firm and ensure beforehand that the internship is an 'assessment internship'. I put this caveat because most of the firms I'm listing also provide internships that are not assessments.
That being said, here are some of those that I know have provided direct assessments (& subsequent PPOs on that basis):
Last year I met a Guy who joined as an A0 at my office. He was 6ft tall, had goofy hair, a cute smile and a heart full of gold. He ticked off all my boxes Religion, Looks, Compatibility, Chemistry, Communication, Intelligence. Needless to say I developed a crush on him within a week's time. He was the one I couldn't even dare to dream about. But universe had other plans for us.
He asked me if we could date in a month's time and I agreed. During work hours, we remained extremely discreet and did not disclose the relationship (though our friends figured out something was cooking) Seniors did try to pull us apart or create unneccessary ego conflicts, but thankfully we were mature enough to not let any of this affect our relationship.
He left office after 3 months and even law to join his family business.
Point being, if the love is real, seal it
Its been 18 months to us, and we are going strong each passing day!!!!
Breaking the 'liberal consensus'. The sheer rudeness of claiming a 'consensus' and not even being defensive about it. Aren't discussions supposed to be had on merits than on 'consensus'.
Quillon pays 15k across all offices. Stipend is performance based. Interned there feb ‘23. (Performance based stipend is the trend there so to speak but really you have to be exceptionally bad to not get it)
you can make your own perfume at home and save money, you can earn big bucks using this DIY hack- Ingredients:
- 3 cloves of garlic - 1 thumb-sized ginger - 1 small red onion - A handful of durian fruit - 2 tablespoons of blue cheese - 1 teaspoon of fish sauce - A pinch of skunk cabbage - 1 cup of pickle juice - 5 drops of patchouli oil - 10 sprigs of cilantro
Instructions:
1. Put on protective gear. 2. Crush garlic and ginger. 3. Grate the red onion. 4. Mash the durian fruit. 5. Crumble the blue cheese. 6. Add the fish sauce. 7. Grate the skunk cabbage. 8. Pour in pickle juice. 9. Mix in patchouli oil. 10. Garnish with cilantro.
Behold, the masterpiece! A fragrance that defies conventions and probably common sense. Spray with abandon, and let the scent-sational disaster unfold. Your job might get in danger and people might never recover from the trauma, but hey, at least you'll be memorable!
I know I am not the kind of person whose opinion you really want. I am a T1 A0 from the '23 Batch and much like you, last year, I was pretty excited to join a T1. 2 months into the job, I wish I knew the whole picture. Even while interning at the firm, I had worked 12 hours on most days, but I could manage it. Now, when I haven't had a single free weekend in 2 months, where I easily spend 14 to 15 hours EVERY DAY in office, I wish I knew how worse the situation could get. I am not at all ranting my life at a T1. Mind you, my partner is one of the best person out there, and my team is also pretty good. But the work, the deadlines, the pressure, its unbearable sometimes. A few days I literally had tears in my eyes, because of the pressure and because, even at home, I just could not find time to have a meaningful conversation with my parents or take them out for dinner after my first salary.
I don't want to scare you. Despite the overhwleming pressure, I love what I do. My only advice is, don't have any expectations. Dont expect that you will get 7 hours sleep, dont expect that you will have atleast some weekends free. My point is, expect the worst, and maybe things will be easier. And yes, you have a year in your hand. Relax and enjoy. Because the next few years are going to be very tiring.
You may want yo visit the website of Vaish Associates Advocates. They publish a beautiful book by the name of India Business Guide. There is a chapter on FEMA. Those 90 pages are drafted meticulously and curated by Senior Partners. You can start that as a reference point.
Besides that you should read FDI Policy in DPIIT website, then read the DI Regulations RBI. and then a cursory reading of FEMA ACT.
While referring to it as "Media & Entertainment Law" may not be entirely accurate as a designated practice area, in practice, it predominantly encompasses Transactional Law, involving aspects such as Intellectual Property Rights, Contracts, Media Finance, Technology, Taxation, Family Law (Succession & Divorce), among others, as well as Dispute Resolution Law, which entails litigation for matters such as Infringement, Royalties, Sexual Harassment, and Breach of Contract.
However, the essence and allure of the concept of Media & Entertainment Law do not solely stem from the legal frameworks or regulations, as you have suggested. Rather, its appeal and significance derive from the dynamic Media & Entertainment industry itself, which serves as the primary realm of operation for clients in this field. While mastering the specific legal skills and specialized practice areas aforementioned is attainable by many, the distinctive factor lies in the talent, intuition, and networking acumen required to excel within this industry. Unlike many other clients, those engaged in Media & Entertainment Law consistently find themselves in the public eye. The imperative to safeguard their reputation, swiftly address challenges that could impede the release of cinematic, musical, or interactive projects, and effectively manage public-facing concerns sets this field apart. Also, dealing with creatives & producers as clients needs a whole different skill set than dealing with bankers, CEOs, etc.
While the domain might not inherently possess an enthralling legal complexity, the clients it serves undeniably offer a captivating dimension. It may be tangential, but the tangible outcomes of one's work hold significance. Being able to associate one's legal contributions with a film, song, or notable figure, and witnessing one's name acknowledged in the credits as a legal consultant, is undoubtedly gratifying. This sentiment contrasts with engagements in high-profile corporate banking and enterprises, where monetary remuneration is substantial but job satisfaction is lacking, and tangible results are scarce. While intricate transactions, mergers, and similar activities may be esoteric to the general public (and some of these big law firm names just sound like family-owned textile shops to laymen), the names of renowned individuals and media entities resonate on a more accessible level due to their ubiquitous presence in daily consumption.
Also, India’s Media & Entertainment industry is expected to reach $ 35.4 Bn by 2025. The need for good lawyers, in a field that was formerly running in a trust-based word-of-mouth contract manner only till now, and is only exploring the exponential growth to come, is important in my opinion.
PS: Additionally, it's worth considering that pursuing a direct entry into the Media and Entertainment sector, as you mentioned, could pose challenges in terms of establishing connections. However, commencing your journey within the legal realm of this industry might offer a strategic approach. This initial step would enable you to cultivate valuable contacts and potentially position yourself to transition to the creative aspects later on. Producers and decision-makers might be more inclined to give credence to a well-founded request for an opportunity when it comes from a qualified legal professional who has collaborated with them, as opposed to an aspiring creative seeking a significant "break" without a track record. Just a thought :)
What just now happened at luthra ? They have a new managing partner, bro, out of the blue. Firm amalgamated with Harry. Arch rival of mohit saraf. Life comes full circle for Harry.
Old pillars of luthra Vikas Srivastava senior partner tax and samir dudhoria senior partner Mergers and acquisitions, Have quit. Never got reported anywhere.
What happened to litigation between mohit and luthra?
Litigation between Bobby, sudhir, luthra and mohit?
Litigation between vijay sondhis family and luthra/bobby/sudhir ?
Will Harry fit the MP profile? Can he replace luthra ? Will other partner accept him as their leader and boss.
Atlas Law Partners, a boutique but full service law firm, based out of Delhi and Gurugram, has merged into Luthra and Luthra. This has led to the infusion of 33 lawyers into the Luthra fold - including 7 partners.
Moreover, Harry Chawla (a pupillage of Rajiv Luthra), the founder of the ALP, has been made a Managing Partner at Luthra.
Will this merger help Luthra and Luthra which has been ailing for the past couple of years with Saraf's exit and Rajiv's demise? Is the appointment of the new MD, a sign of good things to come in the managing committee of the firm?
Kian you should really introduce a feature to mirage such posts and put a read at your own discretion thing. I was eating chicken salad, now have to throw it.
First start with a problem. Create one in your own mind or ask people in the banking and financial or asset management sector.
You can start with asking basic questions such as.
Can I have an account in a German bank, while being a resident of India, for transferring my domestic income to the German bank? What are the compliances I need to follow?
How can I purchase a property in Nigeria using funds in my bank account in India?
Now just extrapolate the above questions over to a business context.
What are the compliances local PE must follow for transferring income generated in India to their parent company's bank account in Germany? What are the compliances to be followed for an Indian company for transferring funds to a Nigerian bank account for spending towards buying land in Nigeria for constructing a factory.
Easiest way would be read Master Directions available on the RBI website. There is master director for each relevant topic - foreign investment, exports, ODI, ECB etc.
Hi there, everyone who has spent enough time on LI has seen content about how hard life can be for A0s at T1. As I understand it, there is a steep learning curve, long hours, and an absence of good communication between the seniors and juniors. The responses to these complaints vary from "quit and find something else" to "stop being entitled and do the hard work"
This question is addressed to SAs, PAs and Partners; what advice would you give to A0s looking to do their best and stick it out at T1s?
I'm from the 2024 batch and I'm genuinely excited to join a T1, albeit slightly nervous because of all the rants I see on LI. I understand that grit is key to succeeding in law firms, and also that this is not for everyone and I respect that, but I'd like to stay on and not burn out in a year (although some people make this sound like an eventuality).
Are the claims about the work life balance and general toxicity of T1s exaggerated? I know that this depends on the firm and the team, but how is it that people across firms and practice areas make this claim?
I'm willing to work hard and keen to prove myself, but I don't want to do this at the cost of my health or sanity. I'd like to get 7 hours of sleep most nights (the occasional exception is completely understandable) and work with nice people.
I understand and acknowledge that A0s know nothing compared to the SAs and Partners who have decades of experience, and that the hierarchy that people sometimes complain about is completely justified (as long as the partners are still kind and have not completely forgotten what it's like to be a junior).
I have a lot of time on my hands this year. What can I do to make the process a little easier for myself next year? Are there skills that I can work on improving now? A few seniors told me to chill all year because I'll never get this kind of time back, seems valid too. Thoughts on this?
What are some things you wish you could say to A0s or your juniors to help them with their performance but you can't because it would be misconstrued?
Thank you so much for taking the time to read this! Really hoping to hear some responses from senior associates and partners
Having seen various advocates make it as a law student, I will tell you that law firm litigation is nothing and adds nothing to court advocacy. You must start as a novice or beginner in the profession under a senior for several years before you get your own clients. Asking for referrals does not help unless you have very strong relationships with such advocates, or they will refer you all the wrong (stingy or no pay, uncooperative, corrupt, abusive, cunning, double gamer) clients.
CAUTION:- Please DO NOT publish at places where it is "easy" to do so by paying a small sum. They are total scams like the one mentioned below.
Publications add value to research and scholarship, and portray your ability to research and your interest apart from your writing skills. These emanate from the editorial selections by the boards, which are medium to tough depending on the blog/ journal. An EASY blog adds NO VALUE to you nor to scholarship.
Rather than just writing blogs for the sake of it, actually work on it with hardwork. Journals by NLUs apart from NLSIU have moderate standards of selection on various subject.
A blog should take you 3-4 weeks of consistent work for it to add any value. 3 days to arrive at a specific topic. 2 days to strategise the structure and introduction. 1 week only for research and the rest for content and checks. Increase this by a week per stage for journals.
Each time you use the software, ask yourself how you can get more efficient. With time, you will get efficient. You cannot get good at a software unless you require to use it frequently. So, you will never get as good as Excel as your clients.
Law firm Litigation Associate with PQE 5 based in Mumbai. Have been trying to find ways to strike out into independent practice in the last couple of years. However for a first generation Advocate and from a service family (absolutely no business people among relatives and friends) getting direct clients has proven difficult.
I have wondered whether instead approaching other independent Advocates (with a client base) for referred drafting and appearance work is a better option to get started and getting seen in court ? There are many Advocates who have a lot of clients, but their team size is small (or they don't have any juniors at all) and they can't attend to all their commitments simultaneously.
Can I offer to do drafting (and low stakes appearances) for them for a nominal fee ? I have already gotten some work like this. But is this scaleable and should I resign from my job to pursue this full time ?
Please note that all the referred work that I got - I had to actively solicit work from these Advocates - in the sense of forcing an introduction and handing out a card. Is that something very negative about an independent practitioner's career ?
Is it possible to be eventually earn enough to match my current law firm salary (around 6 LPA) through such independent referred work ?
How do I hedge against disruptions like long covid lockdowns etc ?
Independent litigators on this site (preferably Mumbai based), just want to pick your brains on this ?
It's not disputes if it's not you going to court. No firm allows it completely.
Reason?
Clients prefer experienced counsels to appear for them not someone who got placed due to their rank and sits behind a laptop. These people can do the drafting and "strategy".
If your want the real litigation experience, just forget everything and sit in a district court for months and observe how CPC/ CRPC are only written on paper. Neither the counsel, nor the judges care.
I hope you are doing well. I, too, am a law student who has strategised internships in a specific niche practice area. In this short analysis, I will not be referring to that practice (CM) but firms in general.
The Big 7 criteria is a slightly inaccurate list of largest firms in India. This is because, firms are divided into practice areas, which are practiced by Partners (Rainmakers), or those who bring in maximal and ever growing revenue to the firm for it to subsist. A Rainmaker is the star in the specific practice area and will remain so even if they shift to another firm, because clients are driven by the legal advisor Partner rather that the name of the firm. For example, ML moving from L&L to Indus.
The "Big 7" or "indian Biglaw" takes into account- maximum practice areas that consist of rainmakers and well recognised by clients which results in- highest salaried pay (not PEP (Profits per Equity Partner) necessarily), larger teams by numbers. Therefore, just being in a tier 1 firm does not mean all its practice areas are.
Boutique firms on the other hand have 1 focused practice area among others which may far be recognised that even tier 1 firms. This does not translate to higher salaried pay, but equal or more PEP, because of the higher revenue generation but lesser salary due to the firm themselves being small.(Exception- ICUL, Andheri Office- Funds, S&R, TT&A {undoubtedly, the exceptions are the highest paying firms in India due to the smaller teams but competitive revenue generation if not more})
In this regard, maybe this is true to an extent (horizontally, in no particular order)-
Yes, the state government matters. Jadavpur U was slated to be converted into an IIT, but the WB govt did "let go" of the University, hence the idea had to be shelved. If the state does not agree, it does not happen.
Hi buddy. I did the same thing. I graduated in 2019 from Delhi University then sat for 2-3 mains of judicial service and after failing in all of them eventually joined in house. I worked in house in reliance for a year then switched to boutique law firm. You can also make a switch but let me tell you law firm lawyers have a prejudice towards in house since they are accustomed to work 9-5(in house). So if you don't get direct entry in tier-1, then join tier-2 and gradually scale up the ladder. Work is good but timings are demanding. You will learn in both positions. In law firm you will learn faster as you will put more hours. Jo jitna time dega vo utna seekhega. Good luck.
I am currently with the Disputes Team in a T-1. While the work and all is okay only, I have serious issues with the time at which my team starts and ends work. Our partner typically starts his day and comes to office at 1-2 and sits till 11-12 in the night. By default we are also expected to sit till 9 atleast.
Whereas, I like my day to start early so that post lunch or around 4-5 on wards I can start getting the extra reading in (like files, judgements, news etc). Essentially that atleast the clerical work and drafting and reviewing internally can be done by 3-4 so that post that one leaves for home and concentrates on the reading bit. I am usually in office by 9 to get a head start but no one in the team shows up before 12.
This has an impact on health because you are getting no movement and exercise or even decent meal timings in. No one in this team is decently fit let alone fit. Sleep schedule is effed as well.
If you all know, can you reccomend teams that usually start early and atleast get the office work done by 4-5( even 6) and post that urgent matters, last minute emails etc etc show up. Will be a huge help! Thanks in advance!
Amit Shah should be the brand ambassador of Quillbot. He has just changed the section number and names of offences and the acts!
On a side note: I hope they really change the names to English. This is hindi imposition at its peak. Someone, who isn't fluent in hindi won't be able to understand which one is IPC, CrPc or evidence!
Totally relatable. I too didn't do decent Internships during my first four years. I was even regretting it for a moment. But now that I read your post and I realise why I didn't. The fomo of the placement season made me forget my reasons lol .
Also stop over apologizing. That too on an anonymous platform. All for nothing. I wouldn't be wrong in assuming you are a girl, because they generally tend to do it more. That is sooo not going to help you in this profession or in life. People will undermine your whole thinking and push their thoughts on you.
Okay let me let this secret out. Some of the most chilled out people are those that do LLM, cake walk through UGC NET and chill out as professors in Tier 2, Tier 3 NLUs. Absolute freshers. Zero industry experience. You can be one of them. And they get paid HANDSOME for nothing. Like zero efforts in taking classes, zero knowledge of subjects.
CS, a supposedly inferior profession, in the legal world, can be an option. Pursue it. Get employed somewhere. Or best would be independent practice. Only certain times of the year will be hectic. But pursuing it is in itself a slavery for the law brains. Not easy.
In house is relatively chill. But to get there you'll have to do this slaving given the competition. At least 10 years workex some places ask.
Judiciary works too. Becoming a law officer in any of those PSUs is good too. But again both are gambles big time. But four years of prep should make making it far more highly probable.
Apart from.tne professor option, all other options require you to inevitably work hard for at least a couple of years to make it the rest of your life easier.
Talking from perspective of 7PQE in a Tier 1/2/3 Law firms.
1. General Corporate - Shift anytime to anywhere. That too with high salaries. The whole world is open. 2. Tax - No need to say. FMCG, Manufacturing companies would take you. Reasonable pay. 3. Labour and Employment - you could lateral, but with a large pay cut. Some very large companies would need you. But the pay wouldn't match firms.
4. Litigation - but you won't do any real work in house. You would be just passive strategist and case manager.
Not so much opportunities, but could still make it -
5. Financial Regulatory (not cap marks) - Brokers, Fund Houses would like to keep you.
6. Banking & Finance, Projects- could lateral.
Future?
6. IP/TMT - people in these practice areas would find more in house opportunities once Data Protection Law is passed.
Worst for any in House lateraling (almost impossible to go in house)
7. Competition/Anti Trust - difficult to be hired in house. Unless in some exceptions like one lawyer for a super large conglomerate. Nobody really wants you.
When you join law firms, you’re just a small cog in a big wheel. So your work will mostly be dry and boring.
What may make it interesting are the people you work with, or some actual legal discussion about some grey area with your team members - which may not even go into the legal document or opinion you are preparing.
Also, here’s a better strategy - instead of trying to find ‘interesting’ practice areas, go to office, finish your work, come home and pursue a hobby which you genuinely like. Nothing beats the creativity and passion you have for something you are already interested in.
Dealt with quite a few of the EC Member at L&L and outside – Karan, Piyush, Avirup, Nishant and they are solid partners. Not sure if the EC members are equity partners.
Advait has to hold the Rajiv’s equity, as he is the only lawyer in the family – I don’t think he is running the firm.
From what I hear, there is a process on for coming up with a revamped governance and equity structure.
I think it is good for the firm – they are moving from one rainmaker, to multiple revenue generating partners.
Here are some (hopefully) helpful suggestions. Thee have worked for me up to a point. To be entirely honest, the most weight I've lost was in the first year of Covid when I wasn't eating outside and was doing a lot of the housework because no maids etc. :-D
1. If you can, speak to a nutritionist to see how you can alter your diet to lose some weight. A keto diet, if done properly and under supervision, actually does help with weight loss, but don't think you'll suddenly drop 5 kg in a couple of weeks. It takes some months and has the potential to cause health issues in some people (my wife and I tried Keto for 6 months some years ago. We lost weight but also ended up with severe dehydration);
2. Try and stop eating junk food altogether save, perhaps, on weekends as cheat days. When I started my first law firm job ~ 20 years ago, the only choice for a meal when you working late nights (and there were MANY of those) was junk food and I'm still trying to get rid of all that fat. Thanks to Zomato/Swiggy there's hundreds of healthier choices these days.
3. Reduce carbs and increase proteins (for e.g., cut back on sugar, potatoes and maida and increase meat intake or greens (if you're a vegan/vegetarian). However, if you are reducing carbs, make sure you're hydrating sufficiently (water, not coke/juice/tea/coffee);
4. Eat a big breakfast, a medium size lunch and a small dinner. If possible, eat dinner before 7 pm and then eat nothing till breakfast the next day.
5. Avoid random snacking. If you can't avoid snacking (no shame in that - I'm one of those people), then reduce your main meal intakes and switch to nuts, black gram, sprouts, makhanas for snacks.
6. Keep up the swimming / other regular exercise. Even if it doesn't help you lose weight, it will keep you fit and limber.
I am an old timer, I come here just to know what my juniors talk. I still remember Legally India in 2011, before making Partner at a law firm commenting and laughing out loud.
We could launch a project to preserve this website.
@Moderator - Please show threads like this to Kian.
The title "Harvard of the East" has always been used within NLS in complete irony. I know nearly one thousand alumni, and not one of them takes that term seriously, or treats it as anything other than a giant joke.
As anyone with a passing interest in Greek drama would tell you, the Greeks used the concepts of the "Alazon" (the vain braggart) and the "Eiron" (the underwhelming counter to the Alazon) to simulate a direct dialogue between the characters and the audience.
Dialogue that is "of Eiron", or "ironic", is meant to talk to two audiences at once, but both within the same person. The first hears the dialogue, but does not understand what it means. The second, on hearing it, is aware of the first audience's lack of awareness, and is also aware of the underlying layers to that dialogue. Irony is a little like quantum superimposition- if an object can be in two places at once in quantum physics, then irony assumes that two memetic units are conveyed, even though only a single meme is immediately apparent.
Sadly, it seems that only one audience exists within you.
Don’t drop out. Take my word for it. You wanna give clat? Give it by all means. Trust me clat has gotten more competitive in recent years and undoubtedly you will face trouble if you don’t have any options at hand. I was at the same situation and thought of dropping out fully for clat. But I stayed there and got a decent rank from a tier-2 nlu itself. I am at Nalsar now. Never regretted my decision for a second. Because in exam at the back of my mind , I had this feeling that even if I don’t crack it I still have a bird at hand. Now how to handle?
1. Donate 4 hours to acad
2. Donate 3.5 hours to clat
A frnd of mine this year cracked ailet from a tier-3 nlu , he mentioned that by morning he got over with the acad stuff and by evening he pretty much focused on clat. All the best!
Since I'm a lawyer, i use a lawyer specific skin care routine.
For the AM - I use a face wash made of Municipal laws. Then i apply the constitution serum on my face so that it retains a facade of integrity. I top it off with a Companies Act sunscreen.
For the PM - i use a deep cleaning facewash made of arbitrary laws. Then I apply the UAPA serum and moisturize with Ordinances and delegated legistlation.
Every Sunday i do a deep chemical peel with amendments.
Moisturize. Marula oil is odour free, light and hydrating. You can use coconut oil at night.
Use an exfoliating face wash or scrub regularly. Sunscreen to protect from aging. It'll bite you later if you skip it. Shampoo and conditioner should depend on hair type. Avoid sulphates and other chemicals that will do long term damage. Hair also needs hydration so make sure that's happening. Bas. Rest is about exercise and diet. You don't have to discuss it with the world. Lots of guys will laugh at you. Let them damage their faces.
I understand that these are not the glory days of Legally India purely based on the comments that I see from time to time. Myself, I came across this platform around a year back and I am so grateful to have come across such a wonderful community of lawyers where people help each other out and even give reality checks from time to time.
Thought getting placed was hard, but here I am, with a job offer (wfh) for an M&A PE VC role- A0, with a decent work life balance!
Cheers to everyone out here! And for all those who are losing faith, things do get better!
Aah, I wish I could say what I am about to write -- to my own younger self, and thank you for giving me that vicarious opportunity.
You see, after having lost my love -- to which I was strongly attached, I grew disillusioned. I also saw other friends who lost their love getting disillusioned themselves. One of them became self-destructive and indulged in self-harming behaviour. Another one I know just lost it and again indulged in self-harming behaviour. I myself became lethargic and lazy and lack all motivation. I tried to psychologically harm those around me, primarily my parents and my sister. They bore with me patiently. I deliberately delayed my marriage to keep them stressed -- since I blame them partly for me losing my love.
I kept delaying my marriage until one day when I realized that love is just about getting used to someone. Before joining an office, I researched on the female staff there. I found one in particular to be quite unattractive to my liking. However, 6 months down the line, I got attracted to her -- and why so? Because she was my desk neighbour. Just seeing her face everyday made her grow on me.
I realized something then. Love is just familiarity. What you are suffering is not the loss of love, but the loss of time you spent on building that familiarity. So my suggestion to you is this - you have a lot of time in your hand to spend again on building familiarity with someone. If you fail to give yourself a chance to build familiarity again with another person - you will just spend some mad amount of time indulging in self-destructive or self-harming behaviour, which will degrade your quality of life and not do anything better for those around you.
You should tell yourself that you have a lot of time in your hands to again build familiarity with a new person. The moment you reach that level of familiarity with someone else -- you will have found love again. Time is in your favour. Time is your only friend. Handle it carefully.
Not sure which is the better private law school that you are attending in Kolkata. I do hope its better because lawfirms do look at the name of your college. Its just how it is. Since you come from a private law college and assuming it has some sort of a placement cell, this would be a good time to network with people who have secured a job with the law firms or went in-house.
1. Cognizant- Nothing there is that you can do about it. The pay is 40k/month and the role is a contracts associate (CLM). They have walk-in interview drives around August. This year it happened on the 1st of August.
2. Tata hires laterally, as much as I am aware of. Even if they do hire freshers, I guess they would vie for the graduates at NUJS. Same for Emami.
3. Accenture does hire Mumbai and Delhi. The Kolkata hiring is slower in that regard. Hopefully your year might have one.
4. Fox Corp will be looking for doling out PPOs around April 2024 (general estimate). Try securing a long term internship during that period. Preferably around February and for three months. Should greatly help your chances.
5. The pay scale in general ranges between 10k-40k. Here is how you have that figure in general. Barring KCO SAM and Argus, you have in-house paying you 40k-issh while firms like Sinha and Co. pay you 10k as a fresher. By Kolkata estimates, 25-30 would be a decent start (this figure varies wildly based on your chosen area of practice).
From what I read a while back, Hammurabi and Solomon was keen on opening offices in Kolkata. Hopefully that works out for you mate!
Also, please look out for firms that are offering remote positions.
Faculty of Law, Delhi University Launches 5-year Integrated Law Programmes [BA-LLB (Hons) & BBA-LLB (Hons)] for admissions in this academic year through CLAT 2023 scores.
A central university, the benefit of studying law in Delhi in a well-established department, with a small batch size and an almost embarrassingly low fee. A solid combination. Isn't it?
D&D does not have any formal recruitment policy. There is no system to consider past interns for any suitable vaccancies. So, having done one or multiple internships does not give you any advantage. You might get lucky if a suitable vaccancy arises at the same time when you send your application, otherwise just forget it.
Payscale would not be the correct term to discuss wages at D&D. Because there are no rules/formula in place to properly determine a compensation structure. In any case the wages are way below the normal industry standards (considering there are no rules, you might get a respectable deal if you have some personal connections or other similar leverage). There's also an annual bonus component but that's always delayed by several months (don't be surprised if you get it in the subsequent cycle). Most possibly, you will leave the firm before getting the bonus.
Also, D&D does not offer any clear career progression roadmap. You will certainly be disappointed if you are expecting promotions as per the industry standards.
Talking about the work culture. D&D follows a work pooling approach. So, you will be reporting to 3-4 partners simultaneously. If that's a turn off for you then don't consider the job.
Coming to the team distinctions, there is a separate disputes team. Corporate team is more like a miscellaneous/sundry jobs team in practice. As a member of corporate team your job shall be to deal with everything under the sun which is not purely disputes (most of the times it will be labour laws, environment laws, regulatory laws, and property laws, along with some transactions and DDs from time to time).
(Survival tip for freshers: You can think of your D&D job as an extended paid internship, which is anyday better than your previous unpaid ones.)
The Faculty of Law, DU, has finally jumped on to the 5-year bandwagon. They will be starting BA LLB and BBA LLB from the next year and admit on the basis of CLAT results.
Maybe they had a better CV, with other internship experience. I think firms are increasingly lowering relevance of only grades, especially CAM as it may not be the perfect metric? My rank is in the 60s and I was offered PPOs at Indus, SAM
I believe in taking care of myself, and a balanced diet and a rigorous exercise routine. In the morning, if my face is a little puffy, I'll put on an ice pack while doing my stomach crunches. I can do a thousand now. After I remove the ice pack, I use a deep pore cleanser lotion. In the shower, I use a water activated gel cleanser. Then a honey almond body scrub. And on the face, an exfoliating gel scrub. Then apply an herb mint facial mask, which I leave on for 10 minutes while I prepare the rest of my routine. I always use an aftershave lotion with little or no alcohol, because alcohol dries your face out and makes you look older. Then moisturizer, then an anti-aging eye balm followed by a final moisturizing protective lotion.
1. ICUL Mumbai has a low attrition rate in the law firm fraternity, which is what they are known for. Reasons - their pay gets superb with time (as once someone is with the firm for more than 2.5 years they also start getting small share in equity profits of the firm doubling there usual good bonus. Nobody is going to get such a perk in a tier 1 firm). So initially you get tier 1 payouts but exceeds that once you remain with the firm for a reasonable time. That’s on the top of good work culture and nil politics. That should explain their relatively quick rise.
2. You will get an easy entry in any good tier 1 firm if you have their tag. A red carpet entry in any tier 1 firm specially if you happen to have their funds team tag. Check out in the market.
3. Guys particularly in the funds and sebi regulatory field are topping all the ranking charts. Firm hosted a grand law firm tournament in MCA BKC last year which was a superhit and the one which every cricket enthusiast in other law firms is waiting to happen again this year. not to forget their foreign offsites which i loved the most more than anything. So pretty decent overall branding for a new team.
I work with a London law firm now with a handsome GBP pay 😁 but can vouch for everything stated above having experienced some of it first hand myself and also knowing the recent developments from the friends and fraternity in mumbai. Advice you to double check all the above with janta working out there to get better comfort. All the best
Brother I happened to have a bad breakup right before Covid in my first year, luckily we had the lockdown and I could recoup and reassess my standing. To be brutally honest it’s super tough and any advice I give might sound cliche but for a week atleast take a break from work/study and do things you love, be it playing a sport, travelling even watching reels if that’s what you like and be positive.
Also ignore the outside noises. Man up & all the best to you 🙌🏻
When I applied for internships - a good decade-and-a-half ago - a rule that I followed was to apply at least 6 months in advance. One of the firms I worked with subsequently usually had their internship slots booked around 3/4 months in advance. So, you should have already applied for internships in December by now.
I had a terrible CGPA, no mooting record, nor any published papers. I was from a good university though, which I suppose led the firms to open and scroll thorugh my resume.
By following my rule, I managed at least 6 to 7 internships on my own, including in top firms, and I think I got 2 internships from college. I managed to get a call back from the internships that I got from college.
In the hindsight, I should have worked on making my resume look a little more professional (just fancy-fying it), I think that would have helped me a little more.
While I graduated with terrible grades and nothing else to justify my time in college, but I managed to secure a job in a decent law firm by just sending 30/40 emails in one vacation to secure an intership for the next vacation. Remember: internships beget internships.
Critically, when you are interning, be super enthu and be open to learning. But also have fun - you can never have too much fun in your youth.
Congratulations to all the new Partners! I thought it would be interesting to find a breakdown of the law schools where these Partners come from. As SAM is the leading law firm in the country, their trends should give us a rough idea about the law firm representation of various colleges.
NUJS- 2
GLC- 2
HNLU- 2
GNLU -2
NLSIU- 1
IIT Kharagpur- 2
NLIU- 1 Mumbai University- 1
UPES- 1
NALSAR- 1
Amity- 1
SLSP- 1
Note- I couldn't find the alma mater of Dnyanraj Desai - Projects & Project Finance (Mumbai)
Inferences-
1. It is a pleasant surprise to see both the IPR Partners are from IIT Kharagpur. Goes on to show the value of niche selection by colleges.
2. HNLU arguably has the best alumni base among all Tier 2 NLUs by far.
3. No surprises at all with GNLU and NUJS who have been dominating corporate placements by absolute numbers for some time now.
4. Lack of NLS and NALSAR shows that their alumni no longer prefer domestic law firms, instead going abroad or in academia/policy/research.
5. The downward spiral of NLIU continues as it remains a shadow of its former glory. The overall Partner base is still the strongest.
6. NLUD has the worst alumni base amongst all Tier 1 NLUs. They still have a long way to go before calling themselves top three.
7. Good to see colleges like UPES, Amity, Mumbai University which proves that colleges don't matter in the long run! JGLS missing like always even though it is Partnership time for their initial batches. Makes you think.
Undergrads in any law school in India barely know how to do any disciplinary/ empirical research. That’s what law school is for. You learn econ well enough maybe you get to assist a prof with competition law or law and poverty type paper. Maybe you make co author . Then maybe after graduating you publish a sole authored paper.
The value of studying economics properly is not in just one CV point.
Fwiw, some of the stuff written by undergrads at nls is actually quite good. Most of it so far has been Doctrinal research but it’s nothing to sneer at.
Bhai/Behan, kya bakchodi kar rahe ho? Bandi/Banda gaye? Jaane do. Ki pharak painda ae? 23-24 saal ke bache ho beh, zindagi padi hai. You'll find love again, and it'll be for the better. The world hasn't ended, there are other people who care for you and a lot of other things that'll make you happy.
I understand it feels empty and impossible, been there done that, was with her for four and a half years, took shit from her, from my family, her family, fucked me up tbh - and she left me for another guy. Not that I blame her, bache thei dono, woh bhi boht toxic aur mai bhi, still it took me three years to move on from her, but when I did move on, I realised how much I missed out on and how I mistreated those who cared for me. Trust me on this, no one is worth a second though after they have left you, you'll only be wasting your time and emotions. Aage badh, chalta hai, hota rahega, rukneka nahi.
Baat rahi batchmates ki, agle saal se majority ki shakal bhi nahi dekhni, temporary insaanon ke liye permanent damage kahe karna baua, khudpe focus karo, aur koi Jawaab nahi hai. Motivation is a scam anyways, just ask yourself do you want to fuck your shit up and slow your life down for a couple of years or process the grief and hurt, move past it, and get on with your life. The answer is pretty simple in my book, is it in yours?
Send internship applications to firms. Once you are there, you perform, and there is a vacancy, you will be considered. Apply to as many places as possible. Reach out to seniors and get a hang of the recruitments everywhere. Be smart about it. Places like SAM, CAM, Khaitan, Trilegal are almost always hiring.
Hey! Since you are a little far off from the actual date of the exam, you would really benefit from working on things that you can't develop/prepare just a few months before the exam (as another comment here has noted). This would primarily include comprehension and text-based reasoning. All of it boils down to really understanding written text. So towards that, you should begin reading newspapers, preferably good quality newspapers, like Hindu (please avoid Times of India as it is overly simplistic). Focus especially on the editorials. These would help your GK and English preparation too. And because you are in 11th grade, I assume you could let our at least an hour daily for newspaper reading, along with others things you might be working on. These newer CLATs focus on comprehension rather your static or factual logic. This should set you up to a good path. Continue experimenting for what helps, what does not. Good luck!
A2 This side. All lawyers’ bands have been revised. The hike for A0s has already been covered in the thread (though I doubt the 3 lakh bonus is guaranteed - it will be prorated for 9 months and in my opinion should also depend on partner rating).
In a novel step, each lawyer has been told in their retainer letter as to how much they stand to make at different performance levels (below expectation (“BE”), meets expectation (“ME”) and exceeds expectation (“EE”)), in addition to the fixed retainer (“FR”). I am mentioning numbers for A1, A2, and A3 levels below but please note that these numbers are lawyer specific and depend on their previous year’s rating as well. All figures in lakhs and pre-TDS.
A1 - 18 FR + [2.85 (BE) / 3.35 (ME) / 4 (EE)].
A2 - 21 FR + [3.57 (BE) / 4.2 (ME) / 5 (EE)].
A3 - 25.5 FR + [4.97 (BE) / 5.85 (ME) / 7 (EE)].
These increased bands are applicable with retrospective effect from 1 April 2023 so everyone who received arrears yesterday got a nice surprise.
PS - I am not aware of SA level pay and not in a position to source these either.
Trilegal just revised their A0 salary by giving a huge hike. Their starting salary package is now around 19.5L, with about 16.5L fixed (from a previous 14.4+2.2 structure). This probably puts trilegal at the top of the paymasters among tier 1s.
Is there any chance that CAM, SAM, KCO, and the like follow suit? Else it is a huge disappointment for all the A0s that opted for other firms during day 0.
Trilegal has made an announcement to increase its retainer pay and performance based pay in light of the firm’s exceptional performance past year. Although the exact figure has not been disclosed yet but the decision has been taken by the management committee.
There is no continuing obligation of Indian citizenship for the Sanad or entitlement to practice in Indian courts. Neither in the act nor in the rules.
Further, if you are OCI (as well as PIO) then by virtue of a gazette notification (issued more than a decade back) you are equal to Indian citizen for the purposes of Advocates Act.
In your case the latter is likely to apply, assuming that you would be registered as an OCI.
So chill and apply for your US citizenship. The Indian lawyers using 'Qualified in India' are doing so legally.
Don't think this is correct. Team has one PA and 3-4 associates with varying degrees of experience and no freshers. Its a good place to learn - they do a lot of structured finance with international funds, public listed debt, projects work in the EV space and some FinTech and regulatory work. Volume of work is high but have heard that folks are also commensurately rewarded. Not a place where you can coast but should definitely consider this if you want to make a career in B&F.
Sudhir does make some valid points, though he could have delivered them more cogently and without his trademark sting! He also did not completely state the argument, and left it to be inferred.
If you remove "Sudhir" from the points made by him, it is apparent that the approach he stated: Inculcating first principles, clinical teaching method, etc., is exactly the USP of NLS from its inception. Someone in this thread rightly pointed that this was not his creation or idea, and that it belonged to Prof Menon. But Prof Menon always stated that it was prevalent abroad and in different disciplines in India (not in law faculties at that time) and that he only borrowed it.
What Sudhir did not call out was that: once the first principles were transmitted in the 1-3 years, the students were allowed to specialize in the 4-5 years. This was the USP of NLS, as this allowed students via the Seminars and Clinical Courses (juxta posed with the internship/placements undertaken in the 3 to 5 years) to actually learn the physical/ground level workings of law. So, the point a lot of folks are making in this thread is addressed.
Guess this is the model across NLU's in India today. While I don't know the exact workings of the course now a days, every college allows students to specialise and intern during their course. So unless the freshly minted International Review Committee, comes up with some novel and path breaking methods, this is the template for the next few years.
P.S. Some things don't change- Sudhir's abhorrence for law firms or corporate jobs is just a legacy issue. It is a fact on record that, Prof Menon was dead against Law Firms or Corporate placements for the students... he sabotaged the 1994 & 1995 batches placements sessions... so much so that he did not permit the 1996 batch to even conduct any placement sessions and they had to rent space at I.I.Sc for conducting their campus placements (hired from 1996 students contributions).
On your question: OCIs can be lawyers in India. There is a GOI notification re the same. Get an OCI card after your citizenship change and you should be fine.
But there are a few larger issues:
(i) Indian lawyers can’t be “employed” - Indian law firms structure their contracts in a retainer-ship form to avoid this. Foreign firms don’t (speaking from my personal experience). Most Indians working abroad with firms are also on employment visas. Therefore, such lawyers must per BCI Rules suspend their Indian license.
(ii) Irrespective of the qualification of their lawyers, foreign law firms cannot practice Indian law. Although there isn’t an explicit prohibition (to the best of my knowledge) in the BCI Rules, but foreign law firms risk it not - both from a bar council and a tax perspective. So that US/UK and India dual qualified tag has no practical utility (except for business development).
In theory, I can’t think of any problems in being a US Citizen+OCI advising on Indian law as a solo practitioner in NY. Hope it helps!
I am 46 (female) in the process of becoming a US Citizen. I am already a green card holder. I did my LLB from India (Uttar Pradesh) and is a member of Bar Council of Gujarat. I was actually a practicing lawyer in Mumbai for a few years before I left India.
I migrated to the US after marriage, did an LLM and became licensed (Bar License) in New York.
On my profile I always write 'India, New York Qualified Immigration Lawyer'.
Can I legally keep it after I become a US citizen? Is it actually legal to keep it?
Why I am asking - even a person of Indian origin cannot be an advocate in India. Only Indian citizens can be an advocate in India. Once you loose your Indian Citizenship ▮▮▮ are technically ineligible to be an advocate or continue as an advocate.
But - A lot of big city new york law firms (global AM100 law firms) actually have lawyers who did LLB from National Law Universities in India, LLM in the US and still keeping "Qualified in India and New York/California'' despite the fact that many of them became citizens years back.
How could these Indian Lawyers keep -" Qualified in India and US". Despite the fact that they are no longer qualified in India?
I am a small time immigration lawyer, so for me these many technicalities doesn't matter. But for firms like Baker and Mckenzie, Latam and Watkins it really does. How could these firms allow thier indian lawyers to still keep this on thier website?
And yet. The nlu model which focuses on teaching first principles and yknow - the law- including yes sociology and history and economics. Has worked. NLS grads have all done well for themselves and found good employment ? Surely if it was such a terrible useless education they would be failing in the workplace ?
He says he doesn’t care about specific industry trends - and that’s honestly a good thing. Chasing excellence is better than chasing trends.
He’s tried very hard to improve clinical education at nls - it’s been better than ever before and certainly better than any other NLU. He’s not opposed to including that stuff - but clearly he thinks teaching craft without teaching the law is gonna make only for very good clerks.
And we should take what he has to say about the best universities seriously considering he’s taught at them/ studied at them, instead of the rantings of undergrads on an anon message board.
A particular senior associate in my team at a tier 2 firm refuses to review any work and sends documents to the clients directly. How risky is this for a junior associate. Do you guys have senior team members like this who are extremely lazy.
or you can become a barrister in the UK and then join any of the presidency high courts which still allow barristers to enrol (need to check the latest rules)
Now let me share an experience which a student had when they wanted to come to India after doing LLB from a top UK uni, they had to come to Delhi, they did not do any bridge course etc. but went directly to the delhi bar and enrolled, then started to work under a senior, no one stopped them after a couple of years they sat for the bar exam and then qualified and is now practicing. They did not appear for the Qualifying Examination For Indian Nationals Holding Foreign Law Degrees, dunno how they managed
The grapevine sources clearly need to do some basic fact checking. As far as I know they are going ahead with some big lateral recruitments soon. JSA onboarded over 10 partners alone in 2023. They also had a very successful client centric event earlier this week. Big hit with big clients.
For nearly 18 minutes everyone else goes on about skill building and online education and industry focussed and let's do away with books and ancient India and yoga and god knows what. Sudhir comes in to say " This conversation is confused" " We don't need a shallow version of craft" "Best universities in the world teach foundational first principles".
the man doesnt shy away from just disagreeing with everyone eh?
This thread should help. Also, you seem like the same person who posted this, or maybe I am wrong.
Kolkata is a smaller city so hirings happen on a 'as per need basis'. The requirements are the same as other law firms. You need better skills to match up since the no. of posts v no. of candidates ratio might give you stiff competition.
ICICI came to our campus for 24 batch last semester. They basically have three-rounds selection process. In the first round, they selected 13 students on the basis of their CV from among 50+ applicants. They select CVs randomly by using a software. There is no specific criteria. They give a lot of weightage to your CGPA though.
In the second round, they give you a legal proposition with two questions for discussion. It was an unmoderated 15 minutes GD and our topic was "AI and Law". Speaking a lot of time did not help the candidates, but cooperating among themselves, not interrupting other speakers and moderating the session own their own helped students to qualify the GD. They selected 7 students from the GD round for their final interview round.
Interview round had both technical and HR questions. Technical questions were based on CV. They were focusing a lot on IBC, fintech laws and banking regulations. Follow up questions and hypothetical questions were also there. There were three HR questions: 1. Introduce yourself; 2. Why are you a right fit for us even when you don't have a lot of banking related work in your CV; and 3. Are you comfortable in relocating to a remote location if we offer you a job?They gave out placement offers to 2 students.
They generally don't look for someone who knows all the laws, but they look for people who can fit into their organisation.
I am aghast by the responses above. You should not be making life-changing decisions based on the insight offered on a private anonymous forum. You should absolutely not be taking any advice from other students only!
Here are the items you should consider:
- A five year education in a law degree is a one time investment. Akin to a one time investment in a business / think of it as a one time investment in yourself, to get a professional certification, compound and pay out over your lifetime.
- SLS Pune is one of the oldest institution offering the degree with thousands of peers and reputation in the market. Jindal, Nirma, Christ, NMIMS, all these private institutions are well regarded nationally. If SLS Pune is your best choice, you have to set yourself up for success and take that chance, to have in place a personal brand, a decently good network and recognition! Remember - you are not just paying for education, but also for (i) good peer network; (ii) good alumni network; (iii) market reputation; (iv) building a personality shaped by experiences and exposures from people in all walks of life. Yes, it could be cheaper than 35L-50L at a government law school, but that does not take away that it is valuable.
- Education is a life long investment - 10 years down the line, when you will be making 50L-1cr if all goes well, your biggest regret will be being petty and stingy about the only investment that you needed to make to achieve the
- I was 17 when I joined the five year law program. The fee at the time seemed massive to me. I graduated to a salary of 6LPA. I switched a couple of years later to a pay check of 20-24 LPA. I currently expect to make 35-40 LPA at 27. Looking back, it has only been 4+ years since my graduation. I have been at the right place at the right time, however, in hindsight, I think not participating in the moot, not experiencing going to that conference, etc. were all myopic decisions. In a career spanning 30+ years, you will make a lot of money, short term loans and setbacks are irrelevant.
- Loans help you stabilise and stay grounded. Value the time you are there and work hard to ensure that you are building skills, network and discipline.
Don't be scared of loans, worst case scenario, you declare bankruptcy. Post that you still retain your degree and can probably get work anywhere because the institution is well recognised. Bad scenario - you figure out law is not what you want to practice - you still have a strong peer / alumni network to succeed in ancillary fields, especially because of the depth of your alum network (anyone graduated from Symbi is your network - it doesn't matter if it is al unorganised, people will be happy to sit and interact with you).
In my humble opinion, I think education loan - if you are considering it at all - is never risky, because you are already sold on the institution, your worry is the fees. Unless something incredibly goes wrong, I don't see anyone regretting that loan 10years down the line. It will look like a minor sum (just don't think about it if you intend to not make use of the degree or stay in a metro city).
In a past radio show, Dame Carol Black, who was the principal at Newnham College Cambridge, was asked about the advice she shares with her students when considering their future. Without missing a beat, she replied, "I tell them to 'have a go'. If you don't go for something you can never have it, you can only have regrets".
The pain of regret is worse than any fear that is holding you back.
Haha. Sudhir has written me several recommendations and I don't meet a single one of the points above. Not a topper, did not drop, did not apply to oxford or yale. never wanted to be a rhodes scholar. Constantly fought with him about issues and disagreed with him.Did not top any exams (double digits in CLAT- but he didnt know me then). Not a snob. pretty silent usually.
I know tons of folks sudhir has mentored who didnt even go to NLUs and were certainly not toppers.
folks are so consistently wrong about him its wild.
All I did was - I worked my butt off for him, proved to him that my grades did not determine my potential, and showed him how honest I was about the work. Build an authentic connection and he might appreciate you. If you try to suck up to him and try and game some system- he might still write you a letter- but he wont actually admire you. Man is all about the work.
If you are sure about getting into corporate practice then don't waste time. Do a 5 year course and start working. Recruiter are little biased towards 5 years students especially from T1 and T2 NLUs. So its better to do 5 years from a good college (T1 and T2 NLUs, Symbiosis, Jindal) and also at the end of the day comes down to hard word, and discipline with a little bit of luck.
Violence started when SC passed the order? Do you not read newspapers, or are you forgetful? Violence was already taking place when the HC had passed its order - which, by the way, violates every known principle of separation of powers, constitutionalism, and goes against a huge line of SC judgements.
I mean. This is what’s weird about this website. You get these loyal cheerleaders from all these colleges who will shout and scream about how they’re number 1. In real life when you go to these universities and spend some time with the students - they’ll admit that their university is quite sub par, that they feel cheated, that it isn’t quite what they imagined. That they thought the faculty would be better, that their peer group would be more driven, that the opportunities they got would be more exciting and that their education would be more rigorous.
But no one online talks about what they should do to make their college better. They just assert that it is and insult people who disagree.
I don’t want nlud or nalsar to just be better than the other. I don’t want them to be satisfied with nirf rankings. I want them to compare themselves to HYP/ Oxbridge and see where they fall short and go and fix their problems. But alas. We’re so happy with our mediocrity.
In my floating academic career I have come across half a dozen VC and have tracked the progress of a few more. In my personal opinion Bhatt has the dubious distinction of being the worst VC in terms of an administrator and person. He suffered from a curious form of policy paralysis whereby he would take a decision reverse it at the slightest protest and then try to sneakily bring that back paddle back and then fret over it. Apart from personal frailties like casteism, chauvinism etc. he also has little vision of building an institution and was more interested in personal gratification like extending his tenure. He let go of the best faculty members that NLUs have ever seen (last couple of years of MP singh). He entered into a faustian bargain with the WB law minister and introduced domicile quota, he also green lighted the second campus, but thankfully a powerful EC member stopped it. He got some land but not the money to build. Like many on the list by OP Bhatt also centralised power to an extent that he would personally intervene on the choice of mopheads to be bought for cleaning floors. I wonder if he had spent more time on academics and retain the talent like Sudhir, Shamnad, Jasmine, Prabhash et al. There is a report which states that over two dozen faculty members quit in the first term of Bhatt. All of them had joined when either Chimni or MP singh were VCs.
“ The National Law School of India University is glad to announce the appointment of the School Review Commission 2023-24 (SRC), comprising Prof. Timothy Endicott as the Chair, and Prof. Catherine O’Regan and Prof David B. Wilkins as Members. The SRC has been appointed by the Chancellor of the University, the Hon’ble Chief Justice of India Dr. D. Y. Chandrachud, in consultation with the Government of Karnataka. The SRC shall undertake a comprehensive review of all aspects of the University and submit its recommendations to the Chancellor in mid-2024.”
Prof Endicott (Oxford), Prof Wilkins (Harvard Law), and Prof O’Reagan (retd South African Constituonal Court judge).
Depends on your area of preference. Say you like insolvency law, you’ll be expected to know the basics and recent updates/amendments ( very imp ones). For instance, are home buyers financial creditors, are share warrants financial debts, if no why? etc. And expect questions based on entries in your CV ( in case you’ve mentioned the work you had done during your internships). Download the AIBE books (available online) for the basics of laws such as contract law, CPC etc ( only prepare for topics that you expect to be questioned on during the interview. Eg if you’re into disputes , you will have to study CPC, contracts law, Arbitration law etc)
And you can also find primers available online ( for insolvency , arbitration etc). Just google “……. Primer online pdf”.
All the best. And one more important thing, maintain your calm and be confident during the interview. You’re not expected to know everything. But the way you articulate the things you know is important.
Examine O.XII of CPC and you'll find your answer. Your post is vague as to how exactly the Claimant has 'relied' upon the document. The exact mode of reliance is the heart of the matter.
Examine applicability of CPC to arbitration proceedings and pull out judgments on this point. Pull out judgments on the point of procedure is handmaid of justice and not its mistress.
As a last resort if nothing works you can file a notice to admit documents and in case the tribunal is inclined to reject it (which it appears likely in your facts and circumstances), you can request the tribunal to rule on this application as part of the final award. Since only your final award is appealable under the Act and not these interlocutory orders and directions.
Research it online, look for reviews. Remember things people say around the office. Start with places that are hipster classy a little further off so you don't run into people you know. Use this to get over your insecurities and become confident. The most classy people are warm and friendly with waitstaff and they tip well. Once you get used to the water, the ordering, thanking and so on, you can move closer. To be truly impressive, it's not about dining in the place. It's about having the warmth and manner that will mean that the staff recognise you, greet you and are extra helpful. That's what a date or a client worth their salt will notice.
Ashish is one of the best legal minds in corporate law. He can see through issues which most other experienced minds cannot.
However, there is little mentoring, he can be moody, and the folks directly working with him end up working with other partners on their deals, so you get the shit-end of the stick on those matters due to the economic model followed in WG.
The upside is that Ashish is typically partial to his direct juniors and hence the pay and promotions are better than the other associates in WG and you will end up working on a wider variety of matters than most of your peers, inside or outside WG - some enjoy that and others don't and sometimes there is more advisory work than is good for you as a junior lawyer.
That being said, not too many of Ashish's juniors are partners in WG today - and those who are in WG today are fairly mediocre (I say this with humility). You need a certain kind of a senior who nurtures and then retains people as they go along thier journey and Ashish isn't one of those seniors. If you are a rank beginner, then this piece is not relevant for you.
If you have a better paying offer, then go for that. Otherwise, you will be able to leverage your time working in WG if you can say you are AAA's junior.
I will still highly recommend the NUSRL students to not further this discussion just for the sake of criticising your batchmates where the same can be done in your college WhatsApp groups/personal groups.Keep it civil. Don’t share personal information as well or we will be forced to close this thread :)
We are taking each and every step to make sure that LI remains a relevant and healthy platform where people can discuss several updates and point out grievances. Any thread spreading misinformation or hatred will be strictly prohibited.
Kian is working extremely hard to maintain decorum in this website. Kindly acknowledge our request ❤️
Best wishes to any candidate aiming for it!
You can take assistance of articles but they can't substitute for judgements.
While the air quality doesn't exactly offer the olfactory delights of a nuclear winter, it does give the uninitiated a teasing whiff of post-apocalyptic perfume. Sure, the city streets may lack those iconic Akira-esque motorcycles, but that absence is more than compensated for by the parade of Cretas and Scorpios, each emblazoned with bumper stickers that scream individuality as loudly as a psychic blast from Tetsuo himself.
So, if you're scouting for a mini-dystopia that comes closest to Neo-Tokyo, look no further than this Trans-Yamuna civilization endearingly and sardonically dubbed "Neeoda." Trust me, it's as if Otomo sketched this urban labyrinth himself, but perhaps decided it was too realistic to include in his manga.
So here I am, trying to make a living and watching life drift by, wondering... is "Fight Club" really that great?
Thanks for the positive feedback on my last post. Today we are going international. In case you missed my previous post, here’s a link to the same:
https://www.legallyindia.com/convos/topic/277270-Banking-Finance-Oversimplified-Part-1#comments
Today we will talk about ECBs – External Commercial Borrowings.
I remember the first time I was put on an ECB transaction, I was just told – go read up the ‘RBI Master Direction on External Commercial Borrowings, Trade Credits and Structured Obligations’. Like a diligent associate I went to the RBI website and downloaded the latest version of this RBI issued law. I mean how difficult could it be? I had to just read the Master Direction, see what law applies to our transaction and then discuss with my senior, right?
WRONG.
Loan Registration Number
Designated Authorised Dealer Category I Bank
FCY denominated ECB
MAMP
Hedging provision
All-in-cost ceiling – “… the swap cost plus spread should not be more than the floating rate plus the applicable spread …”
Wait, what were these technical terms I was reading? I had never come across these before. I was supposed to quickly read through the Master Direction and apply it in the transaction, but I couldn’t make any sense of the document. I couldn’t even understand what the Master Direction was about, let alone ask specific questions. This was a clear case of crash and burn where I had fallen face forward, and I felt completely helpless.
It took me some time to realise that this wasn’t a ‘me’ problem. Without having any background of economics or finance or prior experience, these documents wouldn’t make sense to anyone. At your law firm - as a quick fix - they might probably explain to you a specific item that needs to be inserted in the transaction document, but without understanding the context, that sense of cluelessness will linger on.
Ok Rohit, calm down. Don’t overthink this so much. Deep breaths in. You’ve got this.
So if we can’t figure out ECBs just by reading the Master Direction or a Mondaq article, what’s the solution? Alright, so I have an exercise for you which is going to give you some instant clarity. But you will have to follow the instructions carefully. Ready?
1. Go to your room and close all the doors and windows.
2. Plug in your Amazon electronics
3. Now shout out the following words: “Alexa – play the song ‘Paisa’ from De Dana Dan”
Done? Alright, let’s go:
Here’s the scenario: You have just got your first salary credited after slogging for 14 hours for a month. You have worked harder than ever before and now you deserve a treat. So you go partying at Bastian with your friends and treat yourself to some sushi at Izumi. You somehow manage to save INR 10, 000 from your salary. Now your parents want you to invest this INR 10,000 in a bank. You see that while SBI bank is offering a 4% return, Kotak is offering a 7% interest on fixed deposits. So you go with Kotak.
Now let’s take this one step forward. Banks don’t just make money out of thin air. If they are paying you interest at 7%, that’s because they take your money and lend it someone else at a higher interest rate to make profits. Let’s say the colleague sitting beside you in office had to avail an education loan to complete his college education. When he went to the bank for a INR 10 lakh loan, he noticed SBI offering education loan at 10%, while Kotak offering it at 15%. Obviously, he would choose the SBI loan as at a 10% interest rate on INR 10 lakhs, he would only have to repay just INR 1 lakh as interest, whereas a 15% rate would make the interest INR 1.5 lakh.
ECB works on a similar concept, but with one major difference - instead of shopping which bank to choose while borrowing, you select which country to take a loan from. See, ECB basically means –
..
Money is flowing in FROM abroad INTO India.
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Different countries have different borrowing rates. Developed countries like US usually have 1-2% rate, while emerging markets like India have a borrowing rate of 7%. So, let’s say you’re the CEO of Adani Airport Holdings Limited, managing 7 airports across India. You want to now scale up the airport business for which you need almost $200 million. Instead of going to Indian banks, you go to Standard Chartered and Barclays bank in London to avail that loan as interest rates are lower and this will help save $5 million in interest. Since you will be upgrading the 7 airports in phases, you agree to DRAWDOWN/ use only $50 million this year, and avail the rest of the amount later (in TRANCHES). In your negotiations with the bank, you also tell the banks you should have an option to PREPAY the loan, in case something like Covid happens again and all business halts and there are no fliers coming to airports – meaning no revenue to repay the interest/ loan.
Let’s take another example you might come across deals – ON LENDING. You’re the head of an NBFC in India servicing low income families by extending credit to such people. Usually, such families don’t have any credit score, so the big banks don’t extend loans to them, and they end up taking loans at interest rate of 40% or more from loan sharks (Remember the ban on Chinese fintech apps?). Since the NBFC is anyway working with such low income families, you can’t charge a high rate of interest, but you still need to make a profit. In such a case, you can avail a loan of $200 million from a foreign government owned financial institution which is also involved in increasing credit access amongst masses and which charges interest at 4% per annum. Once you have this $200 million loan, you can use this amount to give multiple INR 50,000 loans to low income families trying to start their business at an interest rate of 5%.
You with me till here? Good.
Now here is where things get interesting. Whenever there is flow of money across Indian borders – be it in the form of FDI or even loans, there’s one entity which keeps a hawk-eye on such transactions – that’s the RBI. RBI and its bunch of minions (aka AD Banks) have created a complicated bunch of laws so they control every aspect of money inflow/outflow. Think of them as the local aunty who’s constantly spying on you:
1. Oh you want to avail a loan? – Go first get a Loan Registration Number (LRN) from us
2. Oh you want to avail a loan from Barclays UK? – we want to know each and every detail – Submit a Form ECB and tell us - who’s the lender, what’s the interest rate, what’s the end use, what’s the repayment period, what charges + processing fees are you paying, what ECB have you availed in the past?
3. Oh you changed your mind and now you want to repay it earlier? – submit another Form ECB (revised)
4. What’s the all-in-cost ceiling? (That’s basically the interest rate, processing and all hidden charges)
5. Which country is the lender/ borrower based in? Does it comply with international financial compliances we have agreed upon (ex – FATF/ IOSCO compliant country)
6. Oh you have been dating this foreigner guy and now you want to get married? You better have dated him for atleast 3 years. Oh wait, did you say he is doctor and has an income of $ 50 million? 1 year of dating is also fine.
Well, the last one isn’t exactly what RBI asks, but that’s MAMP in a nutshell (MAMP: minimum average maturity period) – the minimum amount of time the ECB loan has to be within India. MAMP is usually 3 years for ECBs, but there are carveouts to this general rule – it can be different basis who is the lender/ borrower/ what purpose etc. (Time to pick up that RBI Master Direction and give it a read)
Also, what are the “End use restrictions”? – that’s RBI telling you – you better not take loans to gamble away on betting on the housing market, stock market or some random stock your friend has been telling you about (remember how enthusiastic your friend was about Bitcoin changing the world?)
ROLE AS A LAWYER
As a lawyer, you’re involved in the documentation – let’s say between the Barclays Bank and Adani Airport Holdings. As a lawyer for the Indian borrower, we have to usually review the loan/ facility agreement to ensure all these stringent requirements set down by RBI are met, all necessary forms such as Form ECB are filed, draft security documents if some security is being given in India and obviously ensure that all CP and CS certificates are in place so that our Indian client can avail the loan quickly. ECB transactions also offer you the opportunity to interact with foreign counsels working for the lenders, and speak with the bank officials of the AD Bank. Depending on what the security structure is, and how many lenders are involved, the transaction structure will change, but this is the basics.
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Note: I have used loans to explain ECBs, but it can also involve bonds and other financial instruments.
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That’s ECBs – oversimplified for you. I obviously haven’t (and couldn’t) cover the entire framework. Also, you might have noticed we only covered ECBs, not the ‘Trade Credits and Structured Obligations’ bit of the RBI Master Direction. But I hope this post has given you some amount of clarity about what you’re working on and where your role as a lawyer fits in.
If you want more posts like this, comment “Paisa Paisa” in the comment box, and I will be back with more interesting posts.
.
.
Your Dalal Street attorney,
XOXO
_________________________________________________
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Kya baat hai kya chiz hai paisa
Kya baat hai kya chiz hai paisa
Ek baat mujhe batala de tu
Uss rab se kyun nahi darti hai
.
Also, speak to close friends about this. They may be going through the same issue and will be better abe to sympathise with you. Lawyers need a strong support system which can help them bounce back.
If it’s getting too bad, tolerate it till you have decent level of experience that you can switch to another place.
Cheers
Check it out - https://www.barandbench.com/columns/preventing-brain-drain-in-the-litigation-sphere-how-do-we-make-things-easier-for-young-lawyers
Thanks also to new mods for devoting time and making an effort to sustain this website for free exchange of information and inside secrets of the industry.
@AshReh @TheLord @Waqeel @Tier-1NLU @TroubledLawyer
I started off my career with 11k at a cosmopolitan city and the money I was paid meant I did not have the financial capacity to take a bike on an EMI.
Fortunately, my brother agreed to give his Honda Activa to me and with that, I managed my daily commute.
I spent three months at my first office with a senior who expected me stay in the office from 9.30am to 8.30pm on the weekdays and upto anywhere between 3-4pm on weekends.
I quit in my fourth month and joined a law firm as I came from a law school. I was initially paid a paltry sum but within 2 years, I managed to find a job with a very good salary.
Litigation offices can have bossy people all around who give a damn to your personal and emotional well being.
The senior I worked with was a gentleman who worked more than I did and really took care of me like his younger brother. However, it was not me in time to spend the whole day in the office and yet think thrice to go attend a family's event at 8.30 pm, for that required me to walk upto the senior and ask for a permission to leave the office before he did. Leaving office before your senior does is frowned upon, but that is an established practice and here to stay.
If you intend to continue litigating, you need to forego quite a bit on the personal front in the first six to eight years of your practice.
All the best !
Please only share incident - not names as it will get moderated and defeat the purpose of this thread.
I was motivated to write this post, as I saw my immediate senior get passed over this year for promotion despite him being really good at what he does. My partner was really nice to him until he was a Counsel (he started his career with her) and then she started doing shady things like: (a) she wouldnt let him post legal updates etc on Linkedin or write articles/blogs without her being a co-author; (b) actively stopped him from getting staffed on matters with other partners or close supervision of managing partner; (c) she publicly berated him for not doing BD, but on the other hand would not give him any internal BD opportunities, claim prior relationship with anyone he proposed meeting, refused matters he sourced citing low fees and yet accepted similar matters at lower rates.
We are in a niche practice so its not like leaving for elsewhere is an immediate choice. Now I fear that same will happen to me - is my fear valid? Was this just an equation thing between her and my senior. Surely i wont be treated the way?
That being said, law in general pays poor. There are very few firms that pay decently and even then, the work life is massively screwed for anyone to establish even some semblance of a balance.
Is it interesting? For me, yes and no. Yes because everything I did was new and something to learn, but the work itself isn't inherently interesting. When it starts to get diversified such as assisting on drafting SHA / SSA, research for issuance of legal opinion etc, it gets better.
I left the law firm to join a family member's practice but I wouldn't mind continuing in the firm tbh.
But what’s next? We want premier league tables , more threads on law firms…..
Speaking about the prospects - I will say it’s not bad. You will be eligible for the SEBI Grade A legal manager exam. It will quench your thirst of banking sector a lot. You apply to several independent banking law firms as well. Start out with boutique firms. The legal insight will surely be an advantage in your CV and ofc for your competitive career as well. It will help you in your workplace as well! All the best!
The solution to relocate them is embarrassingly ineffective and unoriginal and moreover, illegal. The dogs are aggressive because they are either in heat or hungry and regularly feeding them, neutering them and vaccinating them is the only viable long term solution and this responsibility falls upon the administration of a college not on animal rights activists.
The people wanting to get them relocated are just trying to illegally remove dogs and resort to a rather ineffective strategy. All the best to that.
In this thread I will pour out my thoughts (opinions) and experience (facts) of legal profession in General.
I am a 2020 grad from Tier -4/5 law school from a far flung no name Law school in a state. After my graduation, I immediately joined litigation. Needless to say, since our college was not so big, our only focus was Bank PO, SSC and other govt competitive exams. Me and my batch mates had no other plans. I tried a few exams then rested my pen. I joined litigation in 2021 under a senior lawyer in District court.
To my shock, juniors were not paid anything ANYWHERE in India regardless the forum, the senior advocates income and size of chamber. I continued to litigate as I had no other option. Meanwhile I came across few people from better Universities and they told me about Corporate Law Firms and how since I dont have any internships and because I am not from an NLU so I dont stand a chance at getting into them. Made me sad. I still message and reply to people working in law firm in hope of getting some guidance and break. But, I have dropped the hope.
Another issue with legal profession as also highlighted by CJI Sir recently is crazy work hours, be it inhouse, law firm or in litigation , litigation is the most toxic profession with crazy work hours. It really messes up family life. It sucks the soul out of your body and you really start to question your value as an individual and your reason to live. In other words, you hit existential crisis which often leads to undiagnosed high functioning depression.
Due to crazy work hours,
So the cast is set now.
The title is pretty self-explanatory.
If you have any clue of vacancies for A0 positions in Gen Corp teams at Law firms around Delhi, Mumbai or Bangalore, it would be a huge help.
Thanks :)
Gandhi had said that you can judge the greatness of a civilisation by the way it treats its animals. Sorry to say, but by this metric NLUJ students (and other NLU dog-hating students) are brutes.
This thread can assist you and solve some of your queries.
We are happy to remove the ‘contested’ tag once we receive concrete information (this may be in any form possible be it authentic links or reports) from your side which can corroborate the conclusion.
https://www.legallyindia.com/convos/topic/229164-trilegal-gurgaon-ma
Some threads where you can reach out to more associates!
https://www.legallyindia.com/convos/topic/243303-working-in-capital-markets-why-are-people-so-afraid-of-it
https://www.legallyindia.com/convos/topic/188294-capmark-vs-ibc-vs-ma-the-better-practice-area
The aforementioned threads can help you a bit!
https://www.legallyindia.com/convos/topic/211295-Link-Legal-Reviews
Sometime back I was also an A0 working in the B&F practice and I was clueless.
I think there was huge gap in my learning because we were not taught this subject in college + B&F as a practice area is very technical + we didn’t having knowledge of financial valuations/ finance side of it + big law firms don’t give you time to absorb and learn - high volume of documents and too many deals happening)
Anyway, here’s me trying to give back to the community by making the transition easier for fresh graduates to your law firm job. We will start with an overview.
OVERVIEW:
So first question - What the hell is banking finance?
Banking & Finance - especially on the Corp side - mostly deals with debentures and loan agreements + security docs. There’s also bit of insolvency, and then some other complicated securitisation and financings. We’ll come to that later.
For now just remember these 3 terms - the bread and butter of most law firms:
NCDs, ECB, ODI financing
Alright, now let’s break it down further. Let’s focus on the basics - 1. Loans & 2. Debentures
Loans
You must have heard of a car loan.
A person goes to the bank. Takes a loan to buy a car. He gives some collateral/ security to the bank in case he defaults in paying back the loan - the collateral can be the car, or some gold deposits in his bank etc.
In law firms, we don’t deal with this. We deal with bigger matters but it’s the same concept. So let’s say a big company like Tata Motors goes to a bank/ NBFC to take a 100 cr loan because it wants to buy the company Jaguar.
Okay, so where do law firms come in? In our earlier example, for the car loan - usually these loan documents are standard documents and the person taking the loan has to just sign the bank document. But let’s say Tata Motors is taking a 100 cr loan. It won’t just sign a standard contract. It will want a tailor-made document for itself so it can save on interest payment/ tax/ have longer repayment period etc. This is where Law firms come in. We draft the loan agreement and the security document basis the commercials agreed between Tata Motors and the bank. We also try to negotiate with the bank so we can get favourable terms for our client.
Wait, what’s a security document? Do you mean like a gold deposit? Well no. This is where your college education might help a bit. Remember learning about the difference between pledge, hypothecation, mortgage in college? Now you get to see these documents in their full fledged glory.
Security documents generally include:
1. Pledge agreements - shares of the borrower/ subsidiary may be pledged as collateral. Let’s say Tata Motors bought some shares in the company Tata Neu. They might pledge those shares of Tata Neu to get a loan from SBI.
2. Hypothecation - Tata Motors has some inventory of cars in its factory/outlet and some regular cash flow from selling these cars. Charge is created on these cars or cash flow in favour of the bank.
3. Mortgage documents - Let’s say Tata Motors just bought a 100 acre land to maybe construct a factory. They hand over the title docs of this property to the bank as collateral (hmm.. which out of the 5 types of mortgage is this?)
There are also other documents often used - non disposal undertakings (aka - don’t you dare sell those shares); trustee agreements (aka - let the trustee handle it, we lenders don’t have so much time); inter creditor agreements (aka - fight club of lenders); escrow agreement (aka - I don’t trust you with the money, so I’m gonna put it with a third party bank account) etc. Anyway, let’s not lose our head over these, backs to basics -
Now depending on the reason the loan is being availed (end use of the loan), your transaction maybe classified as - project finance, acquisition finance, real estate financing. Wait what’s that?
Acquisition finance -
End use: want to acquire another entity
Ex: Flipkart wants to buy Myntra but doesn’t have the money. So it goes to SBI to get 200 cr loan to buy Myntra. Flipkart knows it can repay the loan over 20 years using profits generated from Myntra.
Real estate finance:
End use: build real estate projects / housing
Sobha group wants to build 10 high end condominiums in Whitefield with each unit having a private garden and pool. Say the cost of this is 5cr each unit * 10 units = Project cost 50 cr
So they borrow 60 cr from the ICICI bank, to fund this project. They know that all the millionaires in Whitefield will easily pay 9cr for their properties located in such a prestigious location.
But wait, why borrow 60cr and not 50 cr? Cos it will take them 5-6 years to build the project and during that time, they will also have to pay interest on the loan taken (no income for 5 years as the house isn’t built yet). So although they need 50 cr, they will also need buffer for interest payments.
After 5 years, let’s say all 10 units are sold out for 9cr after launch. So they will have a neat revenue of 9cr * 10 units = 90 cr.
They pay back the bank probably 60 cr and 6 cr interest over a 5 year period, and pocket the rest 90-66 cr = 34 cr as profit.
Project finance:
End use: build projects for which cash flows will only come after extended periods of time.
Example: Constructing the Bandra Worli Sealink. It takes more time than to build residential houses, also you can’t upfront sell the bridge like a house and recover the cost in this case.
Project financing is actually quite interesting and easier to understand when you understand the finance side also.
Disclaimer for A0s - I have over simplified this a bit for your understanding. While all this sounds interesting, you’re job initially will be grunt work - proof reading documents, fixing the cross references, maintaining CP checklists, losing your head in tracking emails, taking notes on calls etc. Life will get chaotic at times.
Don’t lose hope. Try to learn quickly so seniors can trust you with meatier work. Things should get better.
If you want a part 2, where I discuss ECBs (oversimplified), do comment a “Part 2” in the comments so that more people can see this post, and I’ll be back with more interesting posts.
Your Dalal Street attorney
XOXO
First and foremost, let go. Inhale forgiveness and exhale the past. Your former flame made a choice, and so must you. Your focus, my young friend, should be on cracking the life code we call financial independence. Money may not buy happiness, but it offers the freedom to find it on your own terms. You're on the cusp of your final year; it's the perfect moment to hone your skills to a razor-sharp edge, priming yourself to be a force to be reckoned with in your chosen field.
Brace yourself; the industry you're stepping into won't offer you a gentle landing. As a newcomer, you may often feel like you're drowning in a sea of expectations, your capabilities always a notch below what's asked of you. It's a high-stakes arena, and the last thing you need is to get caught in the clutches of your own anxiety. Trust me, in these moments of struggle, the fleeting romantic escapades of the past won't come galloping to your rescue.
In your journey, you'll undoubtedly cross paths with a variety of characters—some genuinely a treasure, but many could very well be the devil incarnate. Navigate with discernment; know when to extend your hand and when to draw your sword. Keep your eyes open, but more importantly, wear your game face. Treasure the comrades who will brave the coming tempests alongside you, for they are your true North Stars.
So, my warrior of life, step into the arena with fire in your belly and thunder in your voice. Take your cue from Nolan's cinematic wisdom: "Rage, rage against the dying of the light." Unfurl your battle cry and march forward, for this, my dear, is your time to shine.
1. though everyone please try to tone it down and de-escalate a little, as much fun as it is to bash each others' law schools :) Criticism is fine, but please don't go overboard and keep harping on the same points, like NLU Delhi fudging figures in NIRF, or NUJS + Mamata = evil, or XNLU being awful, or whatever. Please stick to factual criticism, rather than just opinions, if possible.
2. Genuine request: please tone down politics talk in general. The vast majority of readers and commenters will ultimately not benefit or enjoy if LI turns into an SJW crusader platform, or full of incessant Modi or Raga bashing, or everyone's favourite unwoke WhatsApp uncle foaming at the mouth and railing against the evil Wokes being the end of modern civilisation. There are enough platforms for all this left vs right culture war nonsense and fake news, so if this is important to you, please seek those out rather than LI - there should be plenty of other interesting things for educated lawyers to talk about.
Also, if there is a need for more moderators, would be happy to help! Have received quite some valuable feedbacks from this forum and would definitely love to give back to the community.
Thanks!
1. NLU criticisms. You cannot permit criticism of one NLU and censor/shadow-ban it in the case of another.
2. Politics: Both woke and non-woke views should be given the same treatment.
Due to popular long-running demand and dissatisfaction with the speed of our moderation, we have mixed and opened things up a little as an experiment.
Many thanks to @AshReh, @TheLord, @(Tier-1 NLU), @TroubledLawyer and @waqeel (in alphabetical order), for volunteering in this recent threadfor the (hopefully not) thankless and tough task of mainting a semblance of decorum on LI 🎉
All of their accounts have been upgraded to moderator status, which means they will now have considerable power and responsibility in the LI microcosm, subject to ultimate moderation by our regular mod @LegallyIndia. We have posted some more details in the following thread, which should only be accessible to moderators): https://www.legallyindia.com/convos/topic/277177-welcome-new-mods-lets-talk-moderation-and-community
And if others are interested in volunteering, please let us know in this thread (after having signed up anonymously with your username) - we will likely be shuffling the numbers of moderators around in the coming weeks to find a team that gels well. In the meantime, due to the moderation system, posts will likely get published faster but may sometimes also get unpublished or also get locked for a while.
Good luck, god speed and ❤️! Please let us know how it goes 🧿
Reading of commentaries on FEMA will also help. It's an ocean so be ready for a long journey.
Remember one key thing
Current A/c Transaction - everything is allowed unless specifically prohibited
Capital A/c Transaction - everything is prohibited unless specifically allowed.
Greetings from the land of green rookies and life's perpetual students. I trust this missive finds you luxuriating in Bhopal's embrace. You see, as my freshly minted degree attests, I'm still a novice navigating this thing called life. Now, you may be told by well-meaning, glassy-eyed optimists that "everything will be okay." Such a phrase, I find, translates almost perfectly into "Not-Your-Real-Name."
That 'cream of the corporate' you seek is nothing but a cheap lubricant that your eventual boss/partner/senior/client is eagerly waiting to liberally apply on you (or yours) for every misstep and blunder you make in your romantic ballet of errors. But fret not! Over time, this grotesque lubrication might just become your brand of moisturizer. You'll grow accustomed to its slick sheen, perhaps even find a perverse sort of enjoyment in it. Soon enough, you'll be brandishing your workaholism like a badge of minor honor before your non-lawyerly acquaintances. "Behold," you'll declare, "how thoroughly I've acclimated to my pitiable yet oddly comforting grind!"
As for your feelings of unbelonging at NILU Bhopal, let me offer a modicum of hard-earned wisdom: Rush not toward judgment. The existential boat you find yourself on—be it a yacht, a dinghy, or a rusting submarine—will in due course reveal the fundamental pointlessness or, dare I say, the dizzying complexity of everything and nothing. And perhaps, just perhaps, that will become the cosmic joke you needed all along.
Yours in shared existential folly
The problem with KSLU is that they do not carefully evaluate your answers. Evaluation at KSLU is subpar, and not many students pass on their first attempt. In fact, the pass percentage is so low that no student expects to clear all their papers in one go. However, most students who initially fail end up passing after re-evaluation. It's not impossible, and many students do pass all their papers in the first attempt, but succeeding requires much more than just writing well. Moreover, since it's a state university, there are administrative issues to deal with such as delays in announcing exam dates, making it challenging to plan internships.
This is not meant to discourage you. Students at universities affiliated with KSLU are still succeeding. You just need to put in a bit more effort compared to NLU students. NLS is a great option if you can afford it, but remember that their 3-year program is new (only in its second year). You're better off choosing a college with a strong alumni network and a well-established program. Just ensure that whatever college you choose has excellent administration and a robust support system. KSLU is already challenging to deal with, so don't add a bad college to the mix.
To add more context, here’s the law firm play book -
- attract naive college kids with a 1 lakh package - sounds a lot but when you start living on your own in big cities, you realise it’s not a that much.
- dazzle them with fancy offices, idea of prestige of working at a big brand, working with big companies etc but make them to do clerical work so their exit opportunities are hampered
- create a sense of fear and create a competitive environment where everyone is competing for limited spots and now colleagues won’t hesitate to backstab each other
- tell them how there is serious competition in the market where everyone is undercutting each other fees so they have to work harder (read: work till 4am in the morning and say bye bye to weekends)
- make them work late nights for such long periods, they are now in sleep deprivation mode where their cognitive ability to take rational balanced decisions slowly fades away and they are okay indulging in petty office activities
- make them so tired and exhausted, all lawyers want at the end of the week is a quick relief - where they end up getting hooked to ordering fancy food during late nights(thinking heys it’s on client tab so why not), drinking expensive wine and now they can’t leave the profession cos a normal job won’t financially sustain their self destructive habits
So at the end of the day, (in the initial years) you have mostly due diligence experience with limited exposure to drafting/ negotiation of the main documents and your exit opportunities are seriously hampered. You think to yourself - you can’t go anywhere outside the limited circle, and you’re getting paid decent, so you tell yourself better to stick to the hellhole for a bit longer and not think about the future now.
Disclaimer: This is a slightly pessimistic view on law firms. Obviously not every team is like this. Some teams have better culture, and usually in smaller teams partners care more about their associates and have a healthy humane interaction with their juniors. But basis the way most big law firms are structured and function (massive team sizes), most partners/ seniors don’t have an incentive to be humane considering the insane work load, long hours and competition within law firms.
The hour was encroaching upon the witching time, and the lack of the usual hustle in the coach made my spider-senses twitch. As the train trundled into Mira Road station, I spied a motley crew of gentlemen who looked as if they'd been rehearsing for a heist scene in a B-grade movie. Their poised readiness to board felt like I had an audience awaiting my next move. Trusting my instincts, I sprang to my feet and hastily disembarked, seeking refuge in the adjacent, reasonably populated general compartment.
The universe seemed to smile as I snagged a window seat. Across from me sat three seemingly worn-out souls, whom I mused were just returning from their 9 to 9 grind. Yet, just as I began crafting a heartfelt narrative about these diligent men, Naigaon approached and the plot twisted. One began a loving dance with my wristwatch, another serenaded my phone into his pocket, and the pièce de résistance? The third presented his rusty screwdriver, perhaps thinking I needed a bit of DIY in my life. Their ballet of theft was so swift, it deserved a standing ovation.
As they exited stage left with grace and alacrity, I was left, not with anger, but with an appreciation for their flair. There I was, amidst an audience of weary travelers, pondering the artistry of my own personal pocket-theatre, staged by hardworking men in search of a different kind of payday.
Stick with it
Focus on your grades, and pick a subject to develop expertise(whether new or old, doesn't matter, all practice areas money at different times in the cycle ).
But more importantly, travel, read novels and everything else under the sun, do some sport or gym, get high, laugh and cry with your friends, pick a hobby and explore yourself, because once gone, college life doesn't happen again.
You'll be enough, you'll do good, you'll make your parents proud.
He worries before his time, worries twice. - maybe seneca
Now, coming to the 'influential lobby of HUMAN RIGHTS professors' point. The fact that you created a dichotomy of commercial law and human rights is telling, right? How corporate law produces inequality and hierarchy is something you will not get by reading tech law or finance law. There is no human rights vs. commercial law, there is only human rights AND commercial law; they are not mutually exclusive, unlike your spurious dichotomy might suggest. So, you have to come out of your tiny hole.
If you are so concerned about the funding - where is the private sector funding? Why do law firms not fund chairs which pay so much that Cyril bhai wants to become a professor? Non-commercial law professors are less motivated by money than commercial law people (otherwise they would have opted for other careers), so let the law firms and big tech companies establish exceptionally well-paid chair professorships. Perhaps even the great commercial law professors in institutions abroad might want to come and work in India. Would work well for everyone involved, including the students, university, teachers and the country as a whole.
https://www.healthline.com/health/what-temperature-kills-bacteria
https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/articles/24495-germs
Secondly, if you think it's gross to eat food touched by human feet, then you should google and see in what unhygienic conditions chicken is prepared. The hens poop in their cages and eat the poop. See this article by PETA, which says that you are literally eating bird poop when you eat chicken.
https://headlines.peta.org/chicken-poop/#:~:text=The%20Bottom%20Line%20on%20Chicken%3A%20It%27s%20Crappy&text=coli%20can%20be%20found%20in,coli.
If you are looking into FEMA/ODI, the articles on the website of Resolut works as well. You can also refer to blogs like Mondaq. They have a rich collection authored by various law firms.
I am wondering if I'll move to a Tier 1 firm, what could be my salary expectations and work timings?
Also when I said that an IIM A should do fine, it was purely out of financial concerns. I'm not actually comparing M7 with Indian B Schools. Also the main question I don't think is answered here is:
Is OP doing an MBA purely for the money bracket, and if yes, a money bracket with respect to where? From my understanding, if OP intended to settle outside India, the choices would have become way easier. While it is true that global has the potential to become local any day, it is also true that the packages that are bagged by IIM ABC grads are mostly top-notch with very little wiggle room (pardon me if there are instances that prove otherwise. Not aware of the same). In this light, IIM A just makes more sense economically.
Kindly requesting you all to respect the privacy of our dearest friend Urvi, and her family at this tough and trying time. I am writing this email on behalf of her closest friends, and we know that Urvi has taken this unfortunate step due to very personal reasons and has nothing to do with the college administration. While we understand that the meeting at the auditorium yesterday might have ignited some anger among the student body, kindly understand that at this point the University administration has more important issues to take care of. They are all working to ensure that her family and her friends are taken care of at this hour, and that is definitely the biggest priority. Any issues on condemning a speech can wait for later. We are now solely and only concerned with how her near and dear are. Kindly refrain from reposting any messages of condemnation at least for the initial few weeks so that her family can deal with the grief in a personal matter and not have it made into a politicised conversation and let them grieve in peace. Additionally refrain from starting any threads or conversations regarding this on social media platforms for now, regarding the administration’s stand or her to ensure that her privacy is not violated in the process. She was someone who hated to have her name thrown out and about in any manner. Please adhere to this to respect her late soul. May her rest in peace.
Regards,
Parvati, Kirti, Radhika, Adrija, Ojaswi.
The only downside is that you have to read on your phone or an e-reader, because actually reading a book in court might be looked down upon.
I do support the advice you gave, and with the second paragraph in general.
Mere do paise on this:
1. The top tier firm law partners who are non-NLU were so before NLUs become relevant. If you were to judge based on that criteria alone in today's time, we still have T1,2 and 3 NLUs, where the lowest rung NLUs suffer just as much as outlier colleges.
2. Litigation has always been dominated by state unis for the same reason. Also, the kind of money that is spent in NLUs to obtain the degree, it is generally hard for the NLU grad to shift to litigation with its low paying culture and survive for a significant amount of time before the dice starts rolling.
3. Regarding rigour of NLUs, this is something that most state unis do not get. Your courses are tougher than ours, with dozens of research papers, assignments, moots, paper presentations, seminars and what not.
[I guess] the point that OP is trying to make is that even after doing everything you said in the second paragraph (and as someone who has personally done that to separate myself from the crowd at my state uni), there are still biased notions that are held on by most law firms (not referring to tiers here). Its not like they are not insurmountable, they just require a lot more time than what someone else starting further from the starting line would need. On top of that (as far as LI threads have reported) there is also this particular habit of tiered law firms to discount the years of experience when laterally shifting for better pay and for obvious ambition.
Big dogs are sniffing for the wrong things is what we mean mostly. Am I equivalent to the top crop of NLUs? Probably not. But a lot of students from NLUs who do get hired sometimes do a shabbier job than a big bunch of us and that is where the systemic problem lies.
This is a definitely not normal.
I was an A0 and I made the silliest mistakes. My seniors never shouted at me. Instead they understood and took the time to explain/ show how it is done. I may have been scolded, but not screamed at where I felt like I was being put down.
Some people let power and money get to the head. There’s no excuse be that pathetic. I hope you break the cycle and treat your juniors better.
Actionable advice - if everyone around you is acting as if this normal, stay there for 6 months and try to learn as much as possible and start looking for another job soon.
You’re from SCAM. You already have good brand value. There are enough jobs in the market. Start following recruiters on LinkedIn who keep posting vacancies - Vahura, Adept, Avimukta
You’ll realise your boss doesn’t have that much power over you as you might think he/ she has.
Chin up. Better days are ahead of you.
Just so you know - what you are feeling is valid and lot of us have gone through this. Just to add more context and give you a more proper answer:
First year at a T1 is extremely chaotic. Because you’re suddenly thrown into this fast paced culture which is very different from college. Also, since you’re learning different processes - not just law, but things which aren’t written anywhere (internal law firm workflow/ how courts work/ which senior has what style of working - what he/ she likes dislikes), this just takes up a lot of your time.
Since this isn’t exactly billable work or work in the traditional sense where you are completing a project, you may not realise it, but this is also a groundwork which you need to put in to get a foothold.
Also, from some seniors there is sometimes an expectation that - this person is a junior at beginning of career. They know nothing, so they should sacrifice everything else to learn and make their career. We have slogged and so should they. At times, you might feel like you’re dancing to the tune of your senior (I hope you have reasonable seniors).
And it is partly true. You’re at the beginning of your career. When you’re going from 0 to 1, that extra effort will be required. Think of it this way - you’re building your credibility at this stage where people are monitoring you and trying to form an opinion about you - is he/ she a trustworthy candidate who can take ownership of work. So you need to put in that extra effort.
This is not to say that you should give up all your hobbies. Trust me, only focusing on work - that will drive you crazy. (Been there done that - ended up depressed)
But yes, getting time to read will be difficult. Also since you’ll be cramming yourself with judgements at work, your mind will be constantly overloaded and your mind will crave an instant relief - on weekends automatically you will want to sleep/ do something more dynamic like going out/ watching a movie etc.
But over time you’ll need to draw boundaries at your workplace. Casually discuss with your team members maybe that you like doing/ you have certain hobbies. (Reasonable bosses realise their associates need to recharge) Also, as previously mentioned - reading in the morning when work chaos hasn’t started - that’s a good time to try out (again depends on how your team works/ what time your boss emails you)
Again, these are only generic advice. The specific advice will depend on your specific circumstances. I hope you find your peace and your time to pursue your hobbies. Because as someone once said:
“
Medicine, law, business, engineering, these are all noble pursuits, and necessary to sustain life. But poetry, beauty, romance, love, these are what we stay alive for.
“
~ FR
What if you get a partial ride with fellowship in M7>T15>Europe MBAs. These days these types of fellowships are not uncommon as I mentioned earlier. It just depends on your affordability.
And even if you don't get a scholarship working abroad(in top cities in the west) for 5yrs isn't a bad option, but it is not for everyone.
It would also be worth factoring non financial aspects like staying away from family, working in a new culture, adjusting in a new environment also.
Let's take an example, there is one Private Equity opening in Mumbai 2 candidates with identical soft and hard skills. One is from Booth other is from IIM A. Booth MBA is the clear win. There would be 50 other IIM A candidates the firm would have encountered, but a Booth Candidate clearly sets himself apart from all other candidates.
Talking about Indian Big Shots being from IIM A it's mainly because those Indians who go abroad for a top MBA stay abroad and become biggies abroad in global HQs and he will be superior to the Indian IIM Biggies [lots of famous cases]. (99% of the time). Not that a top foreign MBA can't become a biggie in India, for all you know he will become a biggie faster.
But if you are a person short of funds, if you don't have any goals of immediately working abroad for next 5+yrs simply stick to an Indian B School.
Today many senior professionals I spoke with consider an Indian MBA( which is not an MBA in most of the cases) as an Insult even though they get high salaries. Mostly youngsters fresh out of Grad school with negligible experience and skills get into to IIM ABC after a CAT lottery.
What I want to say is Global can any day become local, but a local can't be global anyday. ( deliberately wrote it wrong grammatically).
Ask yourself a few more questions where would a top millionaire, billionaire, industrialist or a top corporate tycoon send his children for an MBA? Even though his company including senior management will be filled with IIM grads.
Why did Indira Nooyi pick Yale? Why is she critical about Indian B Schools?
No offense to IIMs, they have the geographic advantage. But the world is much bigger than IIM ABC. There are much better options.
There are much better work locations apart from Mumbai Bangalore and Gurgaon.
For client meetings, it's best to smell expensive but restrained. Get a Dior Fahrenheit or a Prada Luna Rossa range.
For when you're socialising, you want to project but not suffocate. Consider a louder perfume like the Sauvage EDT, YSL Y or the Azzaro Wanted lineup.
If you're on a budget, stick to Zara's lineup which are all clones of popular expensive perfumes with scaled down performance. The Seoul is a good all day use frag.
If you're not on a budget, step into the world of Tom Ford, Versace Atelier etc.
Transgenders suffer violence and discrimination because of their non-conformity and their distinctive gender/sex identity, they suffer discrimination solely on the ground of their gender-identity and they are often prohibited from entering many places this is why there is provision for them in Transgender Persons Act, 2019 i.e., denial of the right of passage in public place. They suffer from the curse of untouchability. Their mother and father abandon them from the time of birth. While coming out they suffer from assault and threat to their life from their own family member. They are killed solely on the ground of their gender/sex identity. They are aborted due to their sexual mark. They are subjected to surgery without their consent from their birth. They often drop out from school and run away from their abusive home. They often resort to prostitution and begging. They suffer isolation and a sense of abandonment from their family member. They fear from public so enrolled themselves in distance education.
What more do you need to know? Have you seen anyone suffer from such severe kind of disabilities. Does EWS/SC/ST/OBC face untouchability, abandonment, threat to their life from their own family, denial of the right of passage. The Transgender community does not hold political power due to their extreme backwardness.
Now I have myself wrote to the Chief Minister of Delhi to register one seat for me in NLUD by issuing a Government Order in the memory of supreme sacrifice of Sahibzada Baba Zorawar Singh and Sahibzada Baba Fateh Singh so as to pay homage to the sons who fought for the faith of the motherland.
I am seeking reservation on the basis of exemplary achievement in the field of social work through the agency of law and Constitution of India.
I cannot get in NLUD from AILET -2024, and now my fate lies with the Atishi Singh Education Minister of NCT of Delhi.
Associate: 5.5k - 10k
SA: 8k-12k
PA: 10k-14k
Partner: 10k-15k
A1 - 12k
A2 - 14k
A3 - 20k
Leader - 28k
Head - 55k
1. CAM
(a) Associate: 12,000
(b) SA/PA: 14,000
(c) Counsel/Partner: 16,000-18,000
2. KCO
(a) Associate/SA: 8,000
(b) PA/Counsel: 10,000-12,000
(c) Partners/Senior Partners: 12,000-16,000
1. The vacancy ceased to exist. The firm decided to promote someone internally and not take the risk of hiring someone else and test waters and eventually arrive at a culture shock.
2. The firm opted for someone who had more PQE than you and that trumped your candidature.
3. If it was a client transaction that had drove the decision to hire, maybe things did not work out with the client and hence the aftermath?
State University is always a thing. You will make it big in your career if you keep at it but it takes time and a lot more effort than what others needed. This is in addition to discounting your years of experience when you join a tier 1 law firm and all the BS like that.
For all those who ask "Why did you not retake CLAT?" Let's lay the tables, shall we?
i. Paisa baby. Not everyone of us is born in the lush comfort of Rupee bills.
ii. We may have older parents whom we can't leave behind.
iii. In addition to both, some people just are not comfortable moving out. Yes, they choose to remain inside their shells or well, just like you throw a spear of an absolutely unwarranted and unrelated question everytime someone talks about the hardships faced by state university student.
-Toodles!
Booth>Yale>IIM A.
Also, M7>T15>Top European MBA>IIM ABC> Other Tier 1 B Schools in India.
This is a no brainer. What you choose depends on what you can afford... A Ferrari is better than a BMW, it's a fact but what can you afford?
In all the top US B Schools Scholarships and Fellowships are generous( 30-90% of the class). So if you have scholarship anywhere north of 50% simply go, get a part time job, do whatever you want but go.
If you get a scholarship below 50% go but be aware that to repay such loans you have to work in top cities of the world for 5yrs atleast.
The diversity in top us b schools is excellent. You will come across a few ex MBB Engagement Managers, Ex IB VPs etc.
Coming back to India, even an IIM recruiter will prefer a top foreign MBA over an Indian MBA keeping all other things like performance and skills equal.
This is because MBA is pursued for a brand and not for skill, for skills you have zillions of rigorous in depth professional programmes. And there won't be a reason why one MBA guy would be preferred over another, if it was not for a brand.
Ask yourself the following questions:- Why do IIM ABC students compete like barbarians to get a simple student exchange? Why do IIM ABC grads pursue a 2nd MBA abroad after 5 plus yrs or work experience? Why do top Indian B Schools prefer foreign educated faculty?
No ifs and buts we are still in colonial hangover.
An IIM MBA is not even an MBA in India and abroad. It is more of a PGP or MiM.
Top executives abroad itself ,are critical about Indian MBAs.
Getting into a top B School in India is more of a gamble.
That being said you won't find New York level compensations in Gurgaon.
Your progress depends more on your performance.
But a foreign MBA offers more prestige and options.
That being said, here are some of those that I know have provided direct assessments (& subsequent PPOs on that basis):
CAM (Mumbai Office), AZB (Mumbai Office), SAM (Delhi Office), S&R, TT&A, Veritas, LawNK, Indus, Resolüt & Touchstone.
(Also, this is at least the scene at T1s. I don't know their non-NLU policy etc.)
He asked me if we could date in a month's time and I agreed.
During work hours, we remained extremely discreet and did not disclose the relationship (though our friends figured out something was cooking) Seniors did try to pull us apart or create unneccessary ego conflicts, but thankfully we were mature enough to not let any of this affect our relationship.
He left office after 3 months and even law to join his family business.
Point being, if the love is real, seal it
Its been 18 months to us, and we are going strong each passing day!!!!
- 3 cloves of garlic
- 1 thumb-sized ginger
- 1 small red onion
- A handful of durian fruit
- 2 tablespoons of blue cheese
- 1 teaspoon of fish sauce
- A pinch of skunk cabbage
- 1 cup of pickle juice
- 5 drops of patchouli oil
- 10 sprigs of cilantro
Instructions:
1. Put on protective gear.
2. Crush garlic and ginger.
3. Grate the red onion.
4. Mash the durian fruit.
5. Crumble the blue cheese.
6. Add the fish sauce.
7. Grate the skunk cabbage.
8. Pour in pickle juice.
9. Mix in patchouli oil.
10. Garnish with cilantro.
Behold, the masterpiece! A fragrance that defies conventions and probably common sense. Spray with abandon, and let the scent-sational disaster unfold. Your job might get in danger and people might never recover from the trauma, but hey, at least you'll be memorable!
I don't want to scare you. Despite the overhwleming pressure, I love what I do. My only advice is, don't have any expectations. Dont expect that you will get 7 hours sleep, dont expect that you will have atleast some weekends free. My point is, expect the worst, and maybe things will be easier. And yes, you have a year in your hand. Relax and enjoy. Because the next few years are going to be very tiring.
Enjoy your free time and all the best :)
Besides that you should read FDI Policy in DPIIT website, then read the DI Regulations RBI. and then a cursory reading of FEMA ACT.
You are PRO then
- Trilegal has no Banking partners
- SAM has a bit of work but it's mostly insolvency litigation
- Khaitan has one senior partner so that might be worth looking into
- No clue about AZB
- JSA Gurgaon has a banking team
- Phoenix Legal and SNG do good work
- TTA has recently become a major contender after the Gautam Saha episode
However, the essence and allure of the concept of Media & Entertainment Law do not solely stem from the legal frameworks or regulations, as you have suggested. Rather, its appeal and significance derive from the dynamic Media & Entertainment industry itself, which serves as the primary realm of operation for clients in this field. While mastering the specific legal skills and specialized practice areas aforementioned is attainable by many, the distinctive factor lies in the talent, intuition, and networking acumen required to excel within this industry. Unlike many other clients, those engaged in Media & Entertainment Law consistently find themselves in the public eye. The imperative to safeguard their reputation, swiftly address challenges that could impede the release of cinematic, musical, or interactive projects, and effectively manage public-facing concerns sets this field apart. Also, dealing with creatives & producers as clients needs a whole different skill set than dealing with bankers, CEOs, etc.
While the domain might not inherently possess an enthralling legal complexity, the clients it serves undeniably offer a captivating dimension. It may be tangential, but the tangible outcomes of one's work hold significance. Being able to associate one's legal contributions with a film, song, or notable figure, and witnessing one's name acknowledged in the credits as a legal consultant, is undoubtedly gratifying. This sentiment contrasts with engagements in high-profile corporate banking and enterprises, where monetary remuneration is substantial but job satisfaction is lacking, and tangible results are scarce. While intricate transactions, mergers, and similar activities may be esoteric to the general public (and some of these big law firm names just sound like family-owned textile shops to laymen), the names of renowned individuals and media entities resonate on a more accessible level due to their ubiquitous presence in daily consumption.
Also, India’s Media & Entertainment industry is expected to reach $ 35.4 Bn by 2025. The need for good lawyers, in a field that was formerly running in a trust-based word-of-mouth contract manner only till now, and is only exploring the exponential growth to come, is important in my opinion.
PS: Additionally, it's worth considering that pursuing a direct entry into the Media and Entertainment sector, as you mentioned, could pose challenges in terms of establishing connections. However, commencing your journey within the legal realm of this industry might offer a strategic approach. This initial step would enable you to cultivate valuable contacts and potentially position yourself to transition to the creative aspects later on. Producers and decision-makers might be more inclined to give credence to a well-founded request for an opportunity when it comes from a qualified legal professional who has collaborated with them, as opposed to an aspiring creative seeking a significant "break" without a track record. Just a thought :)
Old pillars of luthra Vikas Srivastava senior partner tax and samir dudhoria senior partner Mergers and acquisitions, Have quit. Never got reported anywhere.
What happened to litigation between mohit and luthra?
Litigation between Bobby, sudhir, luthra and mohit?
Litigation between vijay sondhis family and luthra/bobby/sudhir ?
Will Harry fit the MP profile? Can he replace luthra ? Will other partner accept him as their leader and boss.
We want to know.
Atlas Law Partners, a boutique but full service law firm, based out of Delhi and Gurugram, has merged into Luthra and Luthra. This has led to the infusion of 33 lawyers into the Luthra fold - including 7 partners.
Moreover, Harry Chawla (a pupillage of Rajiv Luthra), the founder of the ALP, has been made a Managing Partner at Luthra.
Will this merger help Luthra and Luthra which has been ailing for the past couple of years with Saraf's exit and Rajiv's demise? Is the appointment of the new MD, a sign of good things to come in the managing committee of the firm?
What are your opinions about this news?
Ref: https://www.barandbench.com/news/harminder-chawla-assumes-the-role-of-managing-partner-at-luthra-and-luthra-law-offices-india
https://www.barandbench.com/news/harminder-chawla-assumes-the-role-of-managing-partner-at-luthra-and-luthra-law-offices-india
For Atlas to get its 27 lawyer firm to join L&L is no small task. The democratization has started again after burning fingers with Mohit Saraf.
You can start with asking basic questions such as.
Can I have an account in a German bank, while being a resident of India, for transferring my domestic income to the German bank? What are the compliances I need to follow?
How can I purchase a property in Nigeria using funds in my bank account in India?
Now just extrapolate the above questions over to a business context.
What are the compliances local PE must follow for transferring income generated in India to their parent company's bank account in Germany?
What are the compliances to be followed for an Indian company for transferring funds to a Nigerian bank account for spending towards buying land in Nigeria for constructing a factory.
This question is addressed to SAs, PAs and Partners; what advice would you give to A0s looking to do their best and stick it out at T1s?
I'm from the 2024 batch and I'm genuinely excited to join a T1, albeit slightly nervous because of all the rants I see on LI. I understand that grit is key to succeeding in law firms, and also that this is not for everyone and I respect that, but I'd like to stay on and not burn out in a year (although some people make this sound like an eventuality).
Are the claims about the work life balance and general toxicity of T1s exaggerated? I know that this depends on the firm and the team, but how is it that people across firms and practice areas make this claim?
I'm willing to work hard and keen to prove myself, but I don't want to do this at the cost of my health or sanity. I'd like to get 7 hours of sleep most nights (the occasional exception is completely understandable) and work with nice people.
I understand and acknowledge that A0s know nothing compared to the SAs and Partners who have decades of experience, and that the hierarchy that people sometimes complain about is completely justified (as long as the partners are still kind and have not completely forgotten what it's like to be a junior).
I have a lot of time on my hands this year. What can I do to make the process a little easier for myself next year? Are there skills that I can work on improving now? A few seniors told me to chill all year because I'll never get this kind of time back, seems valid too. Thoughts on this?
What are some things you wish you could say to A0s or your juniors to help them with their performance but you can't because it would be misconstrued?
Thank you so much for taking the time to read this! Really hoping to hear some responses from senior associates and partners
- An optimistic incoming A0 at a T1
Publications add value to research and scholarship, and portray your ability to research and your interest apart from your writing skills. These emanate from the editorial selections by the boards, which are medium to tough depending on the blog/ journal. An EASY blog adds NO VALUE to you nor to scholarship.
Rather than just writing blogs for the sake of it, actually work on it with hardwork. Journals by NLUs apart from NLSIU have moderate standards of selection on various subject.
A blog should take you 3-4 weeks of consistent work for it to add any value. 3 days to arrive at a specific topic. 2 days to strategise the structure and introduction. 1 week only for research and the rest for content and checks. Increase this by a week per stage for journals.
Regards,
::_
I have wondered whether instead approaching other independent Advocates (with a client base) for referred drafting and appearance work is a better option to get started and getting seen in court ? There are many Advocates who have a lot of clients, but their team size is small (or they don't have any juniors at all) and they can't attend to all their commitments simultaneously.
Can I offer to do drafting (and low stakes appearances) for them for a nominal fee ? I have already gotten some work like this. But is this scaleable and should I resign from my job to pursue this full time ?
Please note that all the referred work that I got - I had to actively solicit work from these Advocates - in the sense of forcing an introduction and handing out a card. Is that something very negative about an independent practitioner's career ?
Is it possible to be eventually earn enough to match my current law firm salary (around 6 LPA) through such independent referred work ?
How do I hedge against disruptions like long covid lockdowns etc ?
Independent litigators on this site (preferably Mumbai based), just want to pick your brains on this ?
Reason?
Clients prefer experienced counsels to appear for them not someone who got placed due to their rank and sits behind a laptop. These people can do the drafting and "strategy".
If your want the real litigation experience, just forget everything and sit in a district court for months and observe how CPC/ CRPC are only written on paper. Neither the counsel, nor the judges care.
I hope you are doing well. I, too, am a law student who has strategised internships in a specific niche practice area. In this short analysis, I will not be referring to that practice (CM) but firms in general.
The Big 7 criteria is a slightly inaccurate list of largest firms in India. This is because, firms are divided into practice areas, which are practiced by Partners (Rainmakers), or those who bring in maximal and ever growing revenue to the firm for it to subsist. A Rainmaker is the star in the specific practice area and will remain so even if they shift to another firm, because clients are driven by the legal advisor Partner rather that the name of the firm. For example, ML moving from L&L to Indus.
The "Big 7" or "indian Biglaw" takes into account- maximum practice areas that consist of rainmakers and well recognised by clients which results in- highest salaried pay (not PEP (Profits per Equity Partner) necessarily), larger teams by numbers. Therefore, just being in a tier 1 firm does not mean all its practice areas are.
Boutique firms on the other hand have 1 focused practice area among others which may far be recognised that even tier 1 firms. This does not translate to higher salaried pay, but equal or more PEP, because of the higher revenue generation but lesser salary due to the firm themselves being small.(Exception- ICUL, Andheri Office- Funds, S&R, TT&A {undoubtedly, the exceptions are the highest paying firms in India due to the smaller teams but competitive revenue generation if not more})
In this regard, maybe this is true to an extent (horizontally, in no particular order)-
___________________________________________
Tier 1 (Growing till recession)- AZB, SAM, CAM (no-one knows why), Khaitan, Trilegal, IndusLaw, JSA
Tier 1 Boutiques- S&R (CM), ICUL (Funds, Andheri Office, Mumbai), TT&A (Banking, DCM)
_____________________________________________
Tier 2 (Growing)- Bharucha, DSK Legal, ELP, Argus.
Tier 2 (Declining to Tier 3)- L&L, Saraf.
Tier 2 Boutiques- Anand & Anand (IP), LKS (Tax- Direct, Indirect, Customs), Offices of Senior Advocates (Disputes {Highest PEP in the world})
Regards,
::_
Here's the 2005 news report.
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/kolkata/iit-status-in-sight-for-two-bengal-varsities/articleshow/1088445.cms
Whereas, I like my day to start early so that post lunch or around 4-5 on wards I can start getting the extra reading in (like files, judgements, news etc). Essentially that atleast the clerical work and drafting and reviewing internally can be done by 3-4 so that post that one leaves for home and concentrates on the reading bit. I am usually in office by 9 to get a head start but no one in the team shows up before 12.
This has an impact on health because you are getting no movement and exercise or even decent meal timings in. No one in this team is decently fit let alone fit. Sleep schedule is effed as well.
If you all know, can you reccomend teams that usually start early and atleast get the office work done by 4-5( even 6) and post that urgent matters, last minute emails etc etc show up. Will be a huge help! Thanks in advance!
Else, send your CV to a partner via someone you know at the firm
All the best!
A: Change the name of the Act to Hindi.
Amit Shah should be the brand ambassador of Quillbot. He has just changed the section number and names of offences and the acts!
On a side note: I hope they really change the names to English. This is hindi imposition at its peak. Someone, who isn't fluent in hindi won't be able to understand which one is IPC, CrPc or evidence!
Also stop over apologizing. That too on an anonymous platform. All for nothing. I wouldn't be wrong in assuming you are a girl, because they generally tend to do it more. That is sooo not going to help you in this profession or in life. People will undermine your whole thinking and push their thoughts on you.
Okay let me let this secret out. Some of the most chilled out people are those that do LLM, cake walk through UGC NET and chill out as professors in Tier 2, Tier 3 NLUs. Absolute freshers. Zero industry experience. You can be one of them. And they get paid HANDSOME for nothing. Like zero efforts in taking classes, zero knowledge of subjects.
CS, a supposedly inferior profession, in the legal world, can be an option. Pursue it. Get employed somewhere. Or best would be independent practice. Only certain times of the year will be hectic. But pursuing it is in itself a slavery for the law brains. Not easy.
In house is relatively chill. But to get there you'll have to do this slaving given the competition. At least 10 years workex some places ask.
Judiciary works too. Becoming a law officer in any of those PSUs is good too. But again both are gambles big time. But four years of prep should make making it far more highly probable.
Apart from.tne professor option, all other options require you to inevitably work hard for at least a couple of years to make it the rest of your life easier.
1. General Corporate - Shift anytime to anywhere. That too with high salaries. The whole world is open.
2. Tax - No need to say. FMCG, Manufacturing companies would take you. Reasonable pay.
3. Labour and Employment - you could lateral, but with a large pay cut. Some very large companies would need you. But the pay wouldn't match firms.
4. Litigation - but you won't do any real work in house. You would be just passive strategist and case manager.
Not so much opportunities, but could still make it -
5. Financial Regulatory (not cap marks) - Brokers, Fund Houses would like to keep you.
6. Banking & Finance, Projects- could lateral.
Future?
6. IP/TMT - people in these practice areas would find more in house opportunities once Data Protection Law is passed.
Worst for any in House lateraling (almost impossible to go in house)
7. Competition/Anti Trust - difficult to be hired in house. Unless in some exceptions like one lawyer for a super large conglomerate. Nobody really wants you.
8. Funds - difficult to make a move.
https://www.news18.com/india/amit-shah-introduces-three-bills-to-replace-ipc-crpc-indian-evidence-act-in-lok-sabha-8532355.html
https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/amit-shah-introduces-bill-in-lok-sabha-for-overhaul-of-criminal-laws-4288957#pfrom=home-ndtv_bigstory
What may make it interesting are the people you work with, or some actual legal discussion about some grey area with your team members - which may not even go into the legal document or opinion you are preparing.
Also, here’s a better strategy - instead of trying to find ‘interesting’ practice areas, go to office, finish your work, come home and pursue a hobby which you genuinely like. Nothing beats the creativity and passion you have for something you are already interested in.
All the best!
Dealt with quite a few of the EC Member at L&L and outside – Karan, Piyush, Avirup, Nishant and they are solid partners. Not sure if the EC members are equity partners.
Advait has to hold the Rajiv’s equity, as he is the only lawyer in the family – I don’t think he is running the firm.
From what I hear, there is a process on for coming up with a revamped governance and equity structure.
I think it is good for the firm – they are moving from one rainmaker, to multiple revenue generating partners.
1. If you can, speak to a nutritionist to see how you can alter your diet to lose some weight. A keto diet, if done properly and under supervision, actually does help with weight loss, but don't think you'll suddenly drop 5 kg in a couple of weeks. It takes some months and has the potential to cause health issues in some people (my wife and I tried Keto for 6 months some years ago. We lost weight but also ended up with severe dehydration);
2. Try and stop eating junk food altogether save, perhaps, on weekends as cheat days. When I started my first law firm job ~ 20 years ago, the only choice for a meal when you working late nights (and there were MANY of those) was junk food and I'm still trying to get rid of all that fat. Thanks to Zomato/Swiggy there's hundreds of healthier choices these days.
3. Reduce carbs and increase proteins (for e.g., cut back on sugar, potatoes and maida and increase meat intake or greens (if you're a vegan/vegetarian). However, if you are reducing carbs, make sure you're hydrating sufficiently (water, not coke/juice/tea/coffee);
4. Eat a big breakfast, a medium size lunch and a small dinner. If possible, eat dinner before 7 pm and then eat nothing till breakfast the next day.
5. Avoid random snacking. If you can't avoid snacking (no shame in that - I'm one of those people), then reduce your main meal intakes and switch to nuts, black gram, sprouts, makhanas for snacks.
6. Keep up the swimming / other regular exercise. Even if it doesn't help you lose weight, it will keep you fit and limber.
Please don't crash this website 🙏
I am an old timer, I come here just to know what my juniors talk. I still remember Legally India in 2011, before making Partner at a law firm commenting and laughing out loud.
We could launch a project to preserve this website.
@Moderator - Please show threads like this to Kian.
As anyone with a passing interest in Greek drama would tell you, the Greeks used the concepts of the "Alazon" (the vain braggart) and the "Eiron" (the underwhelming counter to the Alazon) to simulate a direct dialogue between the characters and the audience.
Dialogue that is "of Eiron", or "ironic", is meant to talk to two audiences at once, but both within the same person. The first hears the dialogue, but does not understand what it means. The second, on hearing it, is aware of the first audience's lack of awareness, and is also aware of the underlying layers to that dialogue. Irony is a little like quantum superimposition- if an object can be in two places at once in quantum physics, then irony assumes that two memetic units are conveyed, even though only a single meme is immediately apparent.
Sadly, it seems that only one audience exists within you.
1. Donate 4 hours to acad
2. Donate 3.5 hours to clat
A frnd of mine this year cracked ailet from a tier-3 nlu , he mentioned that by morning he got over with the acad stuff and by evening he pretty much focused on clat. All the best!
For the AM - I use a face wash made of Municipal laws. Then i apply the constitution serum on my face so that it retains a facade of integrity. I top it off with a Companies Act sunscreen.
For the PM - i use a deep cleaning facewash made of arbitrary laws. Then I apply the UAPA serum and moisturize with Ordinances and delegated legistlation.
Every Sunday i do a deep chemical peel with amendments.
Ciao. <3
Use an exfoliating face wash or scrub regularly. Sunscreen to protect from aging. It'll bite you later if you skip it. Shampoo and conditioner should depend on hair type. Avoid sulphates and other chemicals that will do long term damage. Hair also needs hydration so make sure that's happening. Bas. Rest is about exercise and diet. You don't have to discuss it with the world. Lots of guys will laugh at you. Let them damage their faces.
Thought getting placed was hard, but here I am, with a job offer (wfh) for an M&A PE VC role- A0, with a decent work life balance!
Cheers to everyone out here! And for all those who are losing faith, things do get better!
Thanks LI!
You see, after having lost my love -- to which I was strongly attached, I grew disillusioned. I also saw other friends who lost their love getting disillusioned themselves. One of them became self-destructive and indulged in self-harming behaviour. Another one I know just lost it and again indulged in self-harming behaviour. I myself became lethargic and lazy and lack all motivation. I tried to psychologically harm those around me, primarily my parents and my sister. They bore with me patiently. I deliberately delayed my marriage to keep them stressed -- since I blame them partly for me losing my love.
I kept delaying my marriage until one day when I realized that love is just about getting used to someone. Before joining an office, I researched on the female staff there. I found one in particular to be quite unattractive to my liking. However, 6 months down the line, I got attracted to her -- and why so? Because she was my desk neighbour. Just seeing her face everyday made her grow on me.
I realized something then. Love is just familiarity. What you are suffering is not the loss of love, but the loss of time you spent on building that familiarity. So my suggestion to you is this - you have a lot of time in your hand to spend again on building familiarity with someone. If you fail to give yourself a chance to build familiarity again with another person - you will just spend some mad amount of time indulging in self-destructive or self-harming behaviour, which will degrade your quality of life and not do anything better for those around you.
You should tell yourself that you have a lot of time in your hands to again build familiarity with a new person. The moment you reach that level of familiarity with someone else -- you will have found love again. Time is in your favour. Time is your only friend. Handle it carefully.
1. Cognizant- Nothing there is that you can do about it. The pay is 40k/month and the role is a contracts associate (CLM). They have walk-in interview drives around August. This year it happened on the 1st of August.
2. Tata hires laterally, as much as I am aware of. Even if they do hire freshers, I guess they would vie for the graduates at NUJS. Same for Emami.
3. Accenture does hire Mumbai and Delhi. The Kolkata hiring is slower in that regard. Hopefully your year might have one.
4. Fox Corp will be looking for doling out PPOs around April 2024 (general estimate). Try securing a long term internship during that period. Preferably around February and for three months. Should greatly help your chances.
5. The pay scale in general ranges between 10k-40k. Here is how you have that figure in general. Barring KCO SAM and Argus, you have in-house paying you 40k-issh while firms like Sinha and Co. pay you 10k as a fresher. By Kolkata estimates, 25-30 would be a decent start (this figure varies wildly based on your chosen area of practice).
From what I read a while back, Hammurabi and Solomon was keen on opening offices in Kolkata. Hopefully that works out for you mate!
Also, please look out for firms that are offering remote positions.
https://lawfaculty.du.ac.in/userfiles/downloads/Fiveyearlaw/5yearlawdu.pdf
A central university, the benefit of studying law in Delhi in a well-established department, with a small batch size and an almost embarrassingly low fee. A solid combination. Isn't it?
Payscale would not be the correct term to discuss wages at D&D. Because there are no rules/formula in place to properly determine a compensation structure. In any case the wages are way below the normal industry standards (considering there are no rules, you might get a respectable deal if you have some personal connections or other similar leverage). There's also an annual bonus component but that's always delayed by several months (don't be surprised if you get it in the subsequent cycle). Most possibly, you will leave the firm before getting the bonus.
Also, D&D does not offer any clear career progression roadmap. You will certainly be disappointed if you are expecting promotions as per the industry standards.
Talking about the work culture. D&D follows a work pooling approach. So, you will be reporting to 3-4 partners simultaneously. If that's a turn off for you then don't consider the job.
Coming to the team distinctions, there is a separate disputes team. Corporate team is more like a miscellaneous/sundry jobs team in practice. As a member of corporate team your job shall be to deal with everything under the sun which is not purely disputes (most of the times it will be labour laws, environment laws, regulatory laws, and property laws, along with some transactions and DDs from time to time).
(Survival tip for freshers: You can think of your D&D job as an extended paid internship, which is anyday better than your previous unpaid ones.)
2. You will get an easy entry in any good tier 1 firm if you have their tag. A red carpet entry in any tier 1 firm specially if you happen to have their funds team tag. Check out in the market.
3. Guys particularly in the funds and sebi regulatory field are topping all the ranking charts. Firm hosted a grand law firm tournament in MCA BKC last year which was a superhit and the one which every cricket enthusiast in other law firms is waiting to happen again this year. not to forget their foreign offsites which i loved the most more than anything. So pretty decent overall branding for a new team.
I work with a London law firm now with a handsome GBP pay 😁 but can vouch for everything stated above having experienced some of it first hand myself and also knowing the recent developments from the friends and fraternity in mumbai. Advice you to double check all the above with janta working out there to get better comfort. All the best
Also ignore the outside noises. Man up & all the best to you 🙌🏻
I had a terrible CGPA, no mooting record, nor any published papers. I was from a good university though, which I suppose led the firms to open and scroll thorugh my resume.
By following my rule, I managed at least 6 to 7 internships on my own, including in top firms, and I think I got 2 internships from college. I managed to get a call back from the internships that I got from college.
In the hindsight, I should have worked on making my resume look a little more professional (just fancy-fying it), I think that would have helped me a little more.
While I graduated with terrible grades and nothing else to justify my time in college, but I managed to secure a job in a decent law firm by just sending 30/40 emails in one vacation to secure an intership for the next vacation. Remember: internships beget internships.
Critically, when you are interning, be super enthu and be open to learning. But also have fun - you can never have too much fun in your youth.
NUJS- 2
GLC- 2
HNLU- 2
GNLU -2
NLSIU- 1
IIT Kharagpur- 2
NLIU- 1
Mumbai University- 1
UPES- 1
NALSAR- 1
Amity- 1
SLSP- 1
Note- I couldn't find the alma mater of Dnyanraj Desai - Projects & Project Finance (Mumbai)
Inferences-
1. It is a pleasant surprise to see both the IPR Partners are from IIT Kharagpur. Goes on to show the value of niche selection by colleges.
2. HNLU arguably has the best alumni base among all Tier 2 NLUs by far.
3. No surprises at all with GNLU and NUJS who have been dominating corporate placements by absolute numbers for some time now.
4. Lack of NLS and NALSAR shows that their alumni no longer prefer domestic law firms, instead going abroad or in academia/policy/research.
5. The downward spiral of NLIU continues as it remains a shadow of its former glory. The overall Partner base is still the strongest.
6. NLUD has the worst alumni base amongst all Tier 1 NLUs. They still have a long way to go before calling themselves top three.
7. Good to see colleges like UPES, Amity, Mumbai University which proves that colleges don't matter in the long run! JGLS missing like always even though it is Partnership time for their initial batches. Makes you think.
The value of studying economics properly is not in just one CV point.
Fwiw, some of the stuff written by undergrads at nls is actually quite good. Most of it so far has been Doctrinal research but it’s nothing to sneer at.
I understand it feels empty and impossible, been there done that, was with her for four and a half years, took shit from her, from my family, her family, fucked me up tbh - and she left me for another guy. Not that I blame her, bache thei dono, woh bhi boht toxic aur mai bhi, still it took me three years to move on from her, but when I did move on, I realised how much I missed out on and how I mistreated those who cared for me. Trust me on this, no one is worth a second though after they have left you, you'll only be wasting your time and emotions. Aage badh, chalta hai, hota rahega, rukneka nahi.
Baat rahi batchmates ki, agle saal se majority ki shakal bhi nahi dekhni, temporary insaanon ke liye permanent damage kahe karna baua, khudpe focus karo, aur koi Jawaab nahi hai. Motivation is a scam anyways, just ask yourself do you want to fuck your shit up and slow your life down for a couple of years or process the grief and hurt, move past it, and get on with your life. The answer is pretty simple in my book, is it in yours?
Good luck. :-)
In a novel step, each lawyer has been told in their retainer letter as to how much they stand to make at different performance levels (below expectation (“BE”), meets expectation (“ME”) and exceeds expectation (“EE”)), in addition to the fixed retainer (“FR”). I am mentioning numbers for A1, A2, and A3 levels below but please note that these numbers are lawyer specific and depend on their previous year’s rating as well. All figures in lakhs and pre-TDS.
A1 - 18 FR + [2.85 (BE) / 3.35 (ME) / 4 (EE)].
A2 - 21 FR + [3.57 (BE) / 4.2 (ME) / 5 (EE)].
A3 - 25.5 FR + [4.97 (BE) / 5.85 (ME) / 7 (EE)].
These increased bands are applicable with retrospective effect from 1 April 2023 so everyone who received arrears yesterday got a nice surprise.
PS - I am not aware of SA level pay and not in a position to source these either.
Is there any chance that CAM, SAM, KCO, and the like follow suit? Else it is a huge disappointment for all the A0s that opted for other firms during day 0.
Thoughts?
https://www.mea.gov.in/images/pdf/2oci-notifi2009.pdf
https://www.mea.gov.in/images/pdf/gazettenotificationonrightsofocicardholdersmarch042021.pdf
There is no continuing obligation of Indian citizenship for the Sanad or entitlement to practice in Indian courts. Neither in the act nor in the rules.
Further, if you are OCI (as well as PIO) then by virtue of a gazette notification (issued more than a decade back) you are equal to Indian citizen for the purposes of Advocates Act.
In your case the latter is likely to apply, assuming that you would be registered as an OCI.
So chill and apply for your US citizenship. The Indian lawyers using 'Qualified in India' are doing so legally.
If you remove "Sudhir" from the points made by him, it is apparent that the approach he stated: Inculcating first principles, clinical teaching method, etc., is exactly the USP of NLS from its inception. Someone in this thread rightly pointed that this was not his creation or idea, and that it belonged to Prof Menon. But Prof Menon always stated that it was prevalent abroad and in different disciplines in India (not in law faculties at that time) and that he only borrowed it.
What Sudhir did not call out was that: once the first principles were transmitted in the 1-3 years, the students were allowed to specialize in the 4-5 years. This was the USP of NLS, as this allowed students via the Seminars and Clinical Courses (juxta posed with the internship/placements undertaken in the 3 to 5 years) to actually learn the physical/ground level workings of law. So, the point a lot of folks are making in this thread is addressed.
Guess this is the model across NLU's in India today. While I don't know the exact workings of the course now a days, every college allows students to specialise and intern during their course. So unless the freshly minted International Review Committee, comes up with some novel and path breaking methods, this is the template for the next few years.
P.S. Some things don't change- Sudhir's abhorrence for law firms or corporate jobs is just a legacy issue. It is a fact on record that, Prof Menon was dead against Law Firms or Corporate placements for the students... he sabotaged the 1994 & 1995 batches placements sessions... so much so that he did not permit the 1996 batch to even conduct any placement sessions and they had to rent space at I.I.Sc for conducting their campus placements (hired from 1996 students contributions).
But there are a few larger issues:
(i) Indian lawyers can’t be “employed” - Indian law firms structure their contracts in a retainer-ship form to avoid this. Foreign firms don’t (speaking from my personal experience). Most Indians working abroad with firms are also on employment visas. Therefore, such lawyers must per BCI Rules suspend their Indian license.
(ii) Irrespective of the qualification of their lawyers, foreign law firms cannot practice Indian law. Although there isn’t an explicit prohibition (to the best of my knowledge) in the BCI Rules, but foreign law firms risk it not - both from a bar council and a tax perspective. So that US/UK and India dual qualified tag has no practical utility (except for business development).
In theory, I can’t think of any problems in being a US Citizen+OCI advising on Indian law as a solo practitioner in NY. Hope it helps!
I am 46 (female) in the process of becoming a US Citizen. I am already a green card holder. I did my LLB from India (Uttar Pradesh) and is a member of Bar Council of Gujarat. I was actually a practicing lawyer in Mumbai for a few years before I left India.
I migrated to the US after marriage, did an LLM and became licensed (Bar License) in New York.
On my profile I always write 'India, New York Qualified Immigration Lawyer'.
Can I legally keep it after I become a US citizen? Is it actually legal to keep it?
Why I am asking - even a person of Indian origin cannot be an advocate in India. Only Indian citizens can be an advocate in India. Once you loose your Indian Citizenship ▮▮▮ are technically ineligible to be an advocate or continue as an advocate.
But - A lot of big city new york law firms (global AM100 law firms) actually have lawyers who did LLB from National Law Universities in India, LLM in the US and still keeping "Qualified in India and New York/California'' despite the fact that many of them became citizens years back.
How could these Indian Lawyers keep -" Qualified in India and US". Despite the fact that they are no longer qualified in India?
I am a small time immigration lawyer, so for me these many technicalities doesn't matter. But for firms like Baker and Mckenzie, Latam and Watkins it really does. How could these firms allow thier indian lawyers to still keep this on thier website?
He says he doesn’t care about specific industry trends - and that’s honestly a good thing. Chasing excellence is better than chasing trends.
He’s tried very hard to improve clinical education at nls - it’s been better than ever before and certainly better than any other NLU. He’s not opposed to including that stuff - but clearly he thinks teaching craft without teaching the law is gonna make only for very good clerks.
And we should take what he has to say about the best universities seriously considering he’s taught at them/ studied at them, instead of the rantings of undergrads on an anon message board.
or you can become a barrister in the UK and then join any of the presidency high courts which still allow barristers to enrol (need to check the latest rules)
Now let me share an experience which a student had when they wanted to come to India after doing LLB from a top UK uni, they had to come to Delhi, they did not do any bridge course etc. but went directly to the delhi bar and enrolled, then started to work under a senior, no one stopped them after a couple of years they sat for the bar exam and then qualified and is now practicing. They did not appear for the Qualifying Examination For Indian Nationals Holding Foreign Law Degrees, dunno how they managed
Has anyone watched this?
For nearly 18 minutes everyone else goes on about skill building and online education and industry focussed and let's do away with books and ancient India and yoga and god knows what. Sudhir comes in to say " This conversation is confused" " We don't need a shallow version of craft" "Best universities in the world teach foundational first principles".
the man doesnt shy away from just disagreeing with everyone eh?
For transactional practice 1.75 crore to 2.5 crore.
For dispute varies from 1.2 crore to 2 crore.
This thread should help. Also, you seem like the same person who posted this, or maybe I am wrong.
Kolkata is a smaller city so hirings happen on a 'as per need basis'. The requirements are the same as other law firms. You need better skills to match up since the no. of posts v no. of candidates ratio might give you stiff competition.
In the second round, they give you a legal proposition with two questions for discussion. It was an unmoderated 15 minutes GD and our topic was "AI and Law". Speaking a lot of time did not help the candidates, but cooperating among themselves, not interrupting other speakers and moderating the session own their own helped students to qualify the GD. They selected 7 students from the GD round for their final interview round.
Interview round had both technical and HR questions. Technical questions were based on CV. They were focusing a lot on IBC, fintech laws and banking regulations. Follow up questions and hypothetical questions were also there. There were three HR questions: 1. Introduce yourself; 2. Why are you a right fit for us even when you don't have a lot of banking related work in your CV; and 3. Are you comfortable in relocating to a remote location if we offer you a job?They gave out placement offers to 2 students.
They generally don't look for someone who knows all the laws, but they look for people who can fit into their organisation.
Here are the items you should consider:
- A five year education in a law degree is a one time investment. Akin to a one time investment in a business / think of it as a one time investment in yourself, to get a professional certification, compound and pay out over your lifetime.
- SLS Pune is one of the oldest institution offering the degree with thousands of peers and reputation in the market. Jindal, Nirma, Christ, NMIMS, all these private institutions are well regarded nationally. If SLS Pune is your best choice, you have to set yourself up for success and take that chance, to have in place a personal brand, a decently good network and recognition! Remember - you are not just paying for education, but also for (i) good peer network; (ii) good alumni network; (iii) market reputation; (iv) building a personality shaped by experiences and exposures from people in all walks of life. Yes, it could be cheaper than 35L-50L at a government law school, but that does not take away that it is valuable.
- Education is a life long investment - 10 years down the line, when you will be making 50L-1cr if all goes well, your biggest regret will be being petty and stingy about the only investment that you needed to make to achieve the
- I was 17 when I joined the five year law program. The fee at the time seemed massive to me. I graduated to a salary of 6LPA. I switched a couple of years later to a pay check of 20-24 LPA. I currently expect to make 35-40 LPA at 27. Looking back, it has only been 4+ years since my graduation. I have been at the right place at the right time, however, in hindsight, I think not participating in the moot, not experiencing going to that conference, etc. were all myopic decisions. In a career spanning 30+ years, you will make a lot of money, short term loans and setbacks are irrelevant.
- Loans help you stabilise and stay grounded. Value the time you are there and work hard to ensure that you are building skills, network and discipline.
Don't be scared of loans, worst case scenario, you declare bankruptcy. Post that you still retain your degree and can probably get work anywhere because the institution is well recognised. Bad scenario - you figure out law is not what you want to practice - you still have a strong peer / alumni network to succeed in ancillary fields, especially because of the depth of your alum network (anyone graduated from Symbi is your network - it doesn't matter if it is al unorganised, people will be happy to sit and interact with you).
In my humble opinion, I think education loan - if you are considering it at all - is never risky, because you are already sold on the institution, your worry is the fees. Unless something incredibly goes wrong, I don't see anyone regretting that loan 10years down the line. It will look like a minor sum (just don't think about it if you intend to not make use of the degree or stay in a metro city).
Much love and best wishes for your success
The pain of regret is worse than any fear that is holding you back.
I know tons of folks sudhir has mentored who didnt even go to NLUs and were certainly not toppers.
folks are so consistently wrong about him its wild.
All I did was - I worked my butt off for him, proved to him that my grades did not determine my potential, and showed him how honest I was about the work. Build an authentic connection and he might appreciate you. If you try to suck up to him and try and game some system- he might still write you a letter- but he wont actually admire you. Man is all about the work.
All the best!
👍👍👍👍
https://theprint.in/judiciary/chief-justices-use-their-master-of-roster-powers-to-influence-outcomes-of-key-cases-says-new-book/1682236/
Proficiency in research, reviewing contracts and basic drafting is a big plus.
Basic and workable understanding of Companies Act is presumed.
Always find those small corners where you can add value and be of use to your seniors.
Pour in more efforts than reasonable/ required efforts for the task.
And last but not the least...
Be respectful and approachable.
But no one online talks about what they should do to make their college better. They just assert that it is and insult people who disagree.
I don’t want nlud or nalsar to just be better than the other. I don’t want them to be satisfied with nirf rankings. I want them to compare themselves to HYP/ Oxbridge and see where they fall short and go and fix their problems. But alas. We’re so happy with our mediocrity.
“ The National Law School of India University is glad to announce the appointment of the School Review Commission 2023-24 (SRC), comprising Prof. Timothy Endicott as the Chair, and Prof. Catherine O’Regan and Prof David B. Wilkins as Members. The SRC has been appointed by the Chancellor of the University, the Hon’ble Chief Justice of India Dr. D. Y. Chandrachud, in consultation with the Government of Karnataka. The SRC shall undertake a comprehensive review of all aspects of the University and submit its recommendations to the Chancellor in mid-2024.”
Prof Endicott (Oxford), Prof Wilkins (Harvard Law), and Prof O’Reagan (retd South African Constituonal Court judge).
Depends on your area of preference. Say you like insolvency law, you’ll be expected to know the basics and recent updates/amendments ( very imp ones). For instance, are home buyers financial creditors, are share warrants financial debts, if no why? etc. And expect questions based on entries in your CV ( in case you’ve mentioned the work you had done during your internships). Download the AIBE books (available online) for the basics of laws such as contract law, CPC etc ( only prepare for topics that you expect to be questioned on during the interview. Eg if you’re into disputes , you will have to study CPC, contracts law, Arbitration law etc)
And you can also find primers available online ( for insolvency , arbitration etc). Just google “……. Primer online pdf”.
All the best. And one more important thing, maintain your calm and be confident during the interview. You’re not expected to know everything. But the way you articulate the things you know is important.
So the best of luck to you.
Shraddha Gome Air 60. Plus she was also a recipient of the prestigious Unilevers future leadership programme
Examine applicability of CPC to arbitration proceedings and pull out judgments on this point. Pull out judgments on the point of procedure is handmaid of justice and not its mistress.
As a last resort if nothing works you can file a notice to admit documents and in case the tribunal is inclined to reject it (which it appears likely in your facts and circumstances), you can request the tribunal to rule on this application as part of the final award. Since only your final award is appealable under the Act and not these interlocutory orders and directions.
Try writing bigger letters and leave space between lines
https://www.hindustantimes.com/education/admissions/prof-faizan-mustafa-appointed-vice-chancellor-of-chanakya-national-law-university-in-patna-congratulated-by-cnlu-vc-101689683503800.html
However, there is little mentoring, he can be moody, and the folks directly working with him end up working with other partners on their deals, so you get the shit-end of the stick on those matters due to the economic model followed in WG.
The upside is that Ashish is typically partial to his direct juniors and hence the pay and promotions are better than the other associates in WG and you will end up working on a wider variety of matters than most of your peers, inside or outside WG - some enjoy that and others don't and sometimes there is more advisory work than is good for you as a junior lawyer.
That being said, not too many of Ashish's juniors are partners in WG today - and those who are in WG today are fairly mediocre (I say this with humility). You need a certain kind of a senior who nurtures and then retains people as they go along thier journey and Ashish isn't one of those seniors. If you are a rank beginner, then this piece is not relevant for you.
If you have a better paying offer, then go for that. Otherwise, you will be able to leverage your time working in WG if you can say you are AAA's junior.