Grind for one more year…. Try for a good LLM with scholarship…. Then get experience in some foreign law firm for a few years… Then move into in-house BigCorp or multilateral organisation….

While I completely agree that health is paramount, I have seen my batchmates have endured the grind that you are going through (when they would literally cry/shout/feel depressed, which lasted for the initial 6 to 7 years) and after 16 years of PQE, they have achieved good equilibrium with their health and family life alongside a very high net worth that equity partnership in biglaw generally brings.

My story - joined PSU from campus and stuck there for 16 years with very little progress/ career advancement.

I recently interned here, works seems good. Suryavir, who looks after the legal work, is quite flexible, stringent on timelines but overall good and makes you learn.

Most of their clients are foreign, and they do a a lot of regulatory work in India, litigation exposure is limited to legal notices, negotiations and settlements and advisory, not much court interface but government department regulatory and stat approval.

Work is quite good, decent hours and good team. They pay a stipend, most work is work from home, with weekly visits to office/meeting them for lunch.

I haven't read the book which was recently published.

But certain less relevant aspects which is often overlooked by others is -

1. Highly Meritocratic - No family/caste has power over governance of Trilegal.

Infact the founders doesn't have anything in common except the fact that they are corporate lawyers that too in different areas of practice. 5 founders of Trilegal vary from a Malayalee Christian to Uttar Pradesh Brahmin.

Wheras all other big law firms in India - one family/caste has all the power.

Most big firms - Former AMSS (SAM, CAM) AZB, Luthra etc are either controlled by one strong man/family/caste.

At one point of time (hearsay) Trilegal even used to discourage/kick out people marrying/dating within the same firm because they want to be ultra professional whereas many other firms (AMSS) were very tolerant of the same.

Only other firm which is meritocratic is JSA - in Trilegal's case the firm doesn't even have a name based on founder.

While this might not be a USP in advanced market like US/Europe. It definitely is a big deal in India.

Merit actually works. It's easier to attract the best people when you can show them that what matters is how capable they are.

2. Zero Connections / Clean Image -

Most big law firms in India are heavily politically/family wise commented (CAM - Adani - BJP) AZB (Parsi - Wealth)

Most Trilegal founders or top lawyers didn't have any good connections compared to legacy firms.

Trilegal also avoids Sketchy politically connected clients. They avoid naked lobbying, political influencing etc.

This means they are attractive for clients in western markets where fcpa, ukba is a big deal for whom clean image is important. A western GC would consider that Trilegal is a clean firm.

This is what used to happen in China, Brazil etc. Western GC's prefer giving work to law firms without much political connects just for this clean image.

Many other big firms (Cyril Amarchand, Nishith Desai etc) have even gotten raided by authorities. Just go through a simple Google search.

Political connects are a double edged sword.

3. Wannabe 'Healthy Workspace'

Many other law firms including founders are proud that the office they created is a toxic mess.

Trilegal maybe as bad as AZB/CAM/Khaitan when it comes to hours and culture.

But founders/management do put some serious effort into changing the image. Even thou it's useless stunt. Atleast the message is clear.

Trilegal doesn't take pride in toxicity. Infact they even sends stunt emails to stop partners from yelling, shouting etc.

4. Indian Economy goes burrrrrrrrr

Trilegal was founded in 2000s. Past 20 + years Indian economy was on caffeine. After LPG reforms - Trilegal started at the right time when FDI was flowing into India. India was supposed to be China 2 (which never happened)

In China, in 1980s there were not even a single law firm. But in 2015 the biggest Chinese law firm (Snr Denton) have 7000+ lawyers and around a billion dollar in revenues. Because Chinese economy was on steroids.

Same happened in India, but on a small scale.

5. Lockstep Equity Model -

Trilegal doesn't have an eat what you kill model. They follow Lockstep equity - while this has disadvantages (making some partners lazy) people who work there are deeply invested for the long term due to this compensation structure.

Disadvantage - Trilegal lost Nisha Kaur Oberoi to JSA where the billing model is the latter. Trilegal still could loose more rainmakers to firms like JSA.

no ▮▮▮. An SC candidate with an income over 8 lakhs could be discriminated, but the consequences of such discrimination on him are far LESSER than an SC candidate with an annual income of a lakh. You can only reserve a limit number of seats- and NO ONE is arguing to dilute reservation itself. The reserved seats stay INTACT. The issue is who should be more entitled to it from a given community - the son of an IAS officer or a poor rural child- the former of which might have benefitted from reservation in some aspect of life, but the latter who might have been deprived of education altogether because of their caste. Use your common sense instead of such pseudo elitist consti arguments and you'd have your answer. A constitutional provision or hurdle is not an answer to the social injustice which the present reservation "SYSTEM" reaps.

I am trying to know how fee structures work for senior lawyers practicing in the High Court and tribunals of Kerala especially in comparison with bigger metro bars.

I am curious about the following points and would appreciate inputs from advocates practicing or having knowledge of these courts.

1. Whether seniors usually charge per hearing or per case brief. What kind of retainers or conference fees are common there
2. Rough range of fees charged by the top 2 or 3 names in KHC, both per case/per hearing and per year.
3.What the 10-15 lawyers in KHC usually make yearly.
4. Fees charged by top non designated seniors.
5. What a typical advocate in these states earns after around 5,10 years of practice

Looking for insights based on actual practice, not speculations because we usually have figures about metro cities and 2-3 other High Courts. This thread might help young lawyers who are considering litigation careers in these smaller tier 2 states

They do not appear much. There is no credible litigation face left in ELP Delhi. All advisory people . Good team but they lack a serial litigator. With Naresh Thacker and Jeetu Departure, the gap is big. It is strange that one of the biggest tax litigation firms does not have a face to appear in SC

While the program has a significant public profile, its actual career outcomes are highly concerning. The limited job market results in an unemployment rate exceeding 90% among graduates. Furthermore, individuals with specific subject backgrounds from general classical studies are often more qualified and aligned with the requirements of forensic roles, reflecting the successful hiring practices seen internationally.

https://www.livelaw.in/top-stories/supreme-court-deletes-direction-to-ex-nujs-vc-to-mention-dismissal-of-sexual-harassment-complaint-in-his-resume-310536

To be continued.. .. ?

I am trying to know how fee structures work for senior lawyers practicing in the High Courts of Jammu and Kashmir, Himachal Pradesh, and Uttarakhand, especially in comparison with bigger metro bars.

I am curious about the following points and would appreciate inputs from advocates practicing or having knowledge of these courts.

1. Whether seniors usually charge per hearing or per case brief. What kind of retainers or conference fees are common there
2. Rough range of fees charged by the top 2 or 3 names in each of these high courts, both per case/per hearing and per year.
3.What the 10-15 lawyers in those courts usually make yearly.
4. Fees charged by top non designated seniors.

5. What a typical advocate in these states earns after around 5,10 years of practice

Looking for insights based on actual practice, not speculations because we usually have figures about metro cities and 2-3 other High Courts. This thread might help young lawyers who are considering litigation careers in these smaller hill states and want a realistic picture of the profession there.

I wanted to apply for a PhD in maritime security laws. Here's my two cents ...

GMU is absolutely dependent on GNLU. All their faculties are recent PhD scholars. Absolute not worth spending lakhs for a private university with no decent faculty.

GNLU is a great law school, but when it comes to maritime law it's worse than GMU. Even NLUO is better in maritime law as they have moots and an active society. But then it's NLUO, not worth as a whole.

Centurion is a private university and has no state government or NLU support like GMU. It's in Odisha and if you're aiming for Odisha, the NLUO is miles better.

RRU is an Institute of Eminence/importance, but it's just a tag. It just means that the central government would provide it a bit of preference. However, the faculty is not experienced and I've heard the whole institute is dubious and questionable. They do not have senior professors or popular academicians.

IMU has no law, but it's PhD is definitely interdisciplinary. If you can convince them that your research is strong in maritime research, it's worth it. Others with no legal advisor, it's a tough call whether they select you or not.

Indus is offering better pay than SAM which I am 100% sure of. My friend at SAM Mumbai at the same level as I, made 5 lakhs less than me last year (including the discretionary bonus), 2 lakhs if you remove the discretionary bonus that is paid in July. Indus for sure has, if not better, at least competitive pay at par with AZB, and higher than JSA unless you are homegrown JSA associate in a good billing team which takes your bill share to a higher number.

Only firms that I know of paying better than Indus is CAM and KCO and the difference is only a few lakhs.

But I would take that any day over getting my pqe discounted, being treated like shit in a sea of 1000 lawyers.

As to cost cutting, snacks have been discontinued because of mass wastage of food across offices, specially in Delhi. If there was really cost cutting and the firm struggling, why would they be taking all 5 offices to Vietnam this December for a 4 day office retreat? For attritions, they haven't really been attritions given that the partners have moved laterally with associates.

But anyway, stay happy in your delusional world while you "stand by" till 2 in the night for matters that don't even reach your email.

In the Delhi High Court and the Supreme Court, robes (advocates’ gowns) cost around 1.5k for gritty, low-quality products, and around 2.5k for good-quality jet-black robes, which can usually be negotiated down to 2k.

I’m a first-generation lawyer practicing in Delhi, graduated this year, and my senior has clearly instructed me to wear a robe whenever I appear in the High Court. The problem is: how do I maintain it? I have no idea. It gets dirty too quickly and too easily. Someone even told me it’s a “use and throw” item, and that you’re supposed to replace it every month. If that’s true, why aren’t these things cheaper? It’s only a synthetic layer of cloth.

How do I take care of it? Can I wash it? Obviously I don’t think I should iron it. What else should I know about maintaining a robe? I’m barely earning enough to make it through the month, and this extra cost is too much. Any alternatives?

@Cyril@Shardul 🙏

https://www.instagram.com/p/DRRJc3xjLqL/

It's hard to find details of RAW recruitment for obvious reasons but they are known to induct people from the trainee batches at LBSNAA, however they suffer from bottom of the barrel syndrome and unlike what people believe it's not exactly like Mission Impossible or anything. Most officers don't even carry arms.

For IB details are public knowledge. They don't specifically recruit lawyers in my knowledge but it doesn't exactly hurt.

Delhi was parallel. Kumar Vislaksh largely briefs and appears in few cases but that's also during to high stakes matter. IDT work is very good, not sure on DT. Jeetu in Mumbai had graduated from IDT lit to overall lit in any case. And Kumar was working on pan India matters in any case, plus the relationships are at tax leader level largely. So not much impact of Jeetu's departure.

The SC quota has been virtually monopolised by the landed ▮▮▮ and ▮▮▮ community, while many Dalits from extremely poor communities are being deprived. These people have been classified as Mahadalits by Nitish Kumar in Bihar, but that doesn’t really solve the problem. We need a law that either bans privileged communities like Jats, ▮▮▮, ▮▮▮, ▮▮▮, ▮▮▮ etc from caste reservation (the poor among them can still apply for economic reservation under EBC quota) or bans reservation outright and goes by 100% merit ranks.

What's the kind of pay one can accept if working under him, have heard that he hires associates under r and r law associates and undertakes filing as well.

Have a chance to interview and have heard from interns that they're short staffed. Is it worth taking up employment because he lets you appear before the supreme court at a fresher level as well for procedural things.

I assume the moderator has some special insight into what what this comment means, having marked this as trollish, because I certainly don't. If that is the case, can we please be enlightened? Despite being Gen Z myself, I must confess with hands up to often being unable to understand what one-word responses to certain things mean.

So according to you, a person whose income is above 8 Lakh is not discriminated on the basis of his caste anymore? There is a reason why most of the reputed scholars in constitutional field have been against this move, 16 (4) was never about the individual's upliftment, it literally uses the term "community with lack of representation in government services". Very skewed understanding to say SC/ST reservation is for economic upliftment alone, there are numerous schemes already running for that. Though I understand why one would think otherwise by looking at EWS/non creamy layer reservation for economic upliftment specifically, 16 (4) for SC ST is completely different.

True story. Senior lawyer in Delhi saw me the other day and said: “You need to look sexy, so you can impress people and get a hot girlfriend. Wear some good brands, yaar. What chutiya watch is this? Aur yeh Brezza-Creta chhodo. Get a BMW hatchback, at least. All the hot girls will run after you.”

Yes, he was obviously kidding but that still gives you an insight into Delhi culture. And some people actually believe this shit.

How many of you truly wished you were born to parents both of whom worked crazy law firm jobs? Spending most of your younger years at daycare/nanny, eating food cooked by househelp drowning in oil, your parents kept saying they’re busy but you got to wear a Ralph Lauren T-shirt?

Stop being such a middle-class uncle! We aren’t splurging. Most of our generation don’t want kids hence no need to save for kids. Don’t need a house either in my case, because my parents have one and will pass it on to me.

A Merc is easily affordable for corporate lawyers like us. My personal goal is to get a Maybach.

What he is trying to say while being humble is, that he has hit a lottery. Man is earning well and gets to enjoy vacations and gets to disconnect from emails. That thing "getting to disconnect from emails for a week", I will buy that thing form a law firm for 50 L rupees, if I am earning 1 crore there. What I mean to say is, I am better off earning 50 L and enjoying my life then earning 1 crore and destroying it. But like your friend, I cannot "suggest" or "impose" this on you. I don't want to sway you. Because ultimately it is about money. And this has to come from within yourself.

In India Universities are not offering Europe level courses and contents related to maritime law. Few in India are

GMU with relatively inexperienced faculty and hired small campus from NLU Gandhinagar

Maritime School RRU is offering LLM in maritime law and has excellent support of government

GNLU- few short courses long back but no activity since years and no faculty of maritime law

IMU: no LLM

Centurion University: LLM in maritime law

You guys can call me shallow, if you want, but I genuinely want to know if someone has been through this and was able to work on themselves.

I am a graduate of the 2024 batch from a Tier 2, private law school. I myself started working in the disputes team at a well known law firm. During my time in law school, there was a person on whom I had a great crush, and during the initial days she acknowledged that she also had feelings for me.

Subsequently, she got focused on her studies. After that, while I've been working since over a year now, she kept preparing for UPSC, which she started around the middle of the 4th year of our law school. Last year she was able to clear the prelims but couldn't clear the mains examination. This year she cleared the mains examination as well.

Now she might be appearing for the interview, as the list has her name. I genuinely do not want to see her clearing that interview, but somewhere within myself I know that she is going to clear it. I am not sure if this is too toxic or what. I am not able to focus on myself, and I am more focused on others.

40L at 7 odd years of work experience is absolutely possible, even if it is not a given. 20L at 7 years is for the type of in-house jobs which won't suit most folks who work in good firms - there won't be any challenge or growth in these type of jobs. "In-house" isn't a monolith, there are many types of jobs, with different short and long terms prospects, both financially and in terms of what career you can build in them.

PA1: Well, that's true. For me, Friday is the most productive day. If lucky, you might find yourself quietly enjoying the company of a beautifully crafted liquor. While anxiety and frustration starts building around Saturday evening, it peaks around Sunday evening (even more than one would experience on a Monday). I am desperately looking out for options beyond T1; any inhouse that pays even 60% would be good.

depends on team entirely. cap marks is still recruiting for bo26. gc should have a couple of slots too if you're exceptional. tmt should've finished rolling ppos out by now (they started much earlier than usual because their late approach meant they missed out on bo25), but might be worth interning with tmt right before graduating to fill out any slots.

To everyone suffering from this, been there - it gets better with consistent efforts. While I will not pretend to understand your individual hardships, I will set down what has worked in the past for me: (i) The more you can control your weekend drinking, the less overwhelming the Monxiety is going to be; (ii) Scheduling a game of pickleball, badminton, football or whatever works for you around the 8pm - 9pm mark helps. Releasing endorphins naturally is a great way to let the anxiety be less controlling - basically sweat it out; (iii) The toughest, if you have work for Sunday, try to get done with it by 6pm-ish so that you can have your authority over the 6pm-12am slot; (iv) If you can sleep early and have an activity (Gyming, yoga or reading) for the next morning, that is pretty useful too.

What sucks is the lack of autonomy over our time and not the work itself. I hope these things are helpful, or your find your own which help. Principally, try natural methods to bring down your baseline anxiety on a Sunday - can be achieved by sports, exercising, waking up early, sleeping on time etc (only so that you can claim back more of your time).

Bhai, why are you guys so gloomy, and why is everything always about "if this" or "if that"? You do not need to switch to an in-house role right away. You can simply move to a better law firm. Talk to friends and seniors from law school. Ask them about their teams, what the work is like, and how things are on their side. There are many teams where the work-life balance is not that bad. There are intense phases, but there are also better days, and in some teams you get most weekends off.

Your current team seems too toxic, so switch. Look for a better team, look for better people to work with. Sometimes, working with better people makes all the difference. Ask around and check for vacancies. If, even after moving, you still feel that you cannot continue in law-firms, then you can explore in-house roles or other options.

There are many alternatives, you only need to know where to look. Reach out to people, you will be alright.

Not much, primarily effects future studying prospects, also depends on the system your college has regarding backs. job itself wont be affected but id say do try not to repeat it as you never know how these things can weirdly manifest, on the face of it however 1 failed subject will not make a big difference to your job as such

TLDR: According to these docs, basically less energy for sex and infertility because of hectic lifestyle and stress, leading to IVF (which may or may not succed).

So what's the scene at law firms?

https://www.news18.com/viral/narayana-murthy-72-hour-work-week-remark-gets-warning-from-hyderabad-doctor-9716949.html

Hi Everyone,

I am Prashant Krishnan, Research Manager at Beroe. We are conducting interviews with SMEs across categories including legal services on how AI impact. It would be great if you can share your thought along with your name and designation. I will be happy to share your perspectives in our report and will also share a complimentary copy of our report.

Look forward to getting your perspectives