Breaking: Amarchand Mangaldas Delhi managing partner Shardul Shroff sues brother Cyril in Bombay HC [UPDATE-5]

A tale of two cities: Shardul v Cyril (l. to r.)
A tale of two cities: Shardul v Cyril (l. to r.)
”)

Amarchand Mangaldas Delhi managing partner Shardul Shroff has filed legal action in the Bombay high court against his brother and Mumbai-region managing partner Cyril Shroff.

According to authoritative sources, Amarchand’s Mumbai office was served the legal notice this evening.

Bharucha & Partners is appearing for Shardul Shroff, according to the Bombay high court case status. Bharucha & Partners was started in 2008 by senior Amarchand Mumbai partners MP and Alka Bharucha.

Update: Federal & Rashmikant is representing Cyril and the other respondents, according to the Times of India.

Background

It is understood that the claim revolves around a conflict over the equity division between the two brothers after three months ago their mother, Bharati Shroff, passed away.

Bharati Shroff was the single largest equity holder at Amarchand.

According to sources, it is understood that the partnership deed envisaged her equity to be split evenly between the brothers in the event of her death.

However, it is understood that Bharati Shroff’s will allegedly conflicts with the deed.

We have reached out to Cyril Shroff and Shardul Shroff for comment.

Case status (Update-1)

There is a notice of motion and a declaratory suit, both under the Code of Civil Procedure, with the reference Shardul Suresh Shroff vs Cyril Suresh Shroff, Vandana Vyril Shroff, L Viswanathan, James Abraham, George Goulding, Ashwin Maheshwari and the firm M/S Amarchand and Mangaldas and Suresh Shroff and Co (NMSL/2559/2014 and SL/1072/2014, respectively).

There is also a petition for probate under section 5 of the Indian Succession Act (Law regulating succession to deceased person’s immoveable and moveable property, respectively), filed by Shardul Shroff against the estate of his later mother (TPL/1864/2014).

Viswanathan is a Mumbai-based equity partner and management committee member.

Goulding and Abraham are respectively former partners at UK law firm Slaughter and May and consultancy BCG, who are both part of the firm’s management committee as independent members who commit at least 40 days per year to help in managing the firm.

Maheshwari is the firm’s chief financial officer (CFO).

Amarchand is India’s largest law firm with around 700 lawyers and 86 partners, planning to grow to 1,000 lawyers and 100 partners by 2017.

Management at the firm is split between two regions – Mumbai, and Delhi – with Cyril Shroff in Mumbai overseeing the Bangalore, Chennai and Hyderabad offices, and Shardul Shroff in Delhi managing Kolkata, Ahmedabad and Gurgaon.

The possible crux of the dispute (Update-2)

CNBC-TV18 executive editor Menaka Doshi and founder of the TV show The Firm, has blogged that according to a source, Bharati Shroff held around 22 per cent equity, while each of the brothers held 17 – 18 per cent, with Bharati Shroff having willed her entire equity stake to the elder brother, Shardul.

With the disclaimer that she had not seen the petition and neither of the Shroffs had made a comment, Doshi wrote:

A Family Framework Agreement (FFA) in 2001 apparently codified 3 important principles.

- Branch equality and that no member of the family will act in any way to jeopardise branch equality

- That the Shroff family will vote at all times in a single block

- That, upon her death, Mrs. Bharati Shroff’s interest in the partnership will be divided equally between her 2 sons

I’m told all members of the family were signatories to this FFA and over the last decade the FFA became core to the partnership understanding in Amarchand as the firm expanded, reorganised and brought in more partners..

Mrs. Shroff’s decision to bequeath all her property, specifically her entire Amarchand partnership interest solely to Shardul Shroff is being interpreted as a breach of the FFA and partnership understanding. It apparently prompted Cyril Shroff to distribute her partnership units equally, in an effort to give effect to the FFA. Cyril’s decision to distribute the units equally between himself and Shardul was ratified by the Managing Committee at Amarchand. But Shardul Shroff has interpreted Cyril’s action as inter-meddling with the estate of his late mother, of which he is executor and sole beneficiary.

Hence he has filed a legal suit against Cyril Shroff in the Bombay High Court. At the same time he has also filed his mother’s will for probate.

MSM coverage (Update-3)

Two mainstream papers covered the dispute on Saturday morning. The Times of India carried a short article, reporting that Cyril Shroff has instructed Mumbai firm Federal & Rashmikant (hat-tip @superselector5 on Twitter).

The Economic Times in a detailed article, rich with apparent insider info, had a comment from Cyril Shroff:

I will never initiate any legal action which is public in nature, as it impacts the family and firm’s name. I have not yet decided as to whether I am accepting the will or not. We are more focused on our clients, partners and people working with us, and for them there will be business as usual.

An Amarchand Delhi spokesperson told ET that “this is an internal family matter and we do not wish to comment on such issues”.

The ET wrote that the the brothers’ jointly held around 60 per cent of equity in the firm and that a 1994 agreement between the family envisaged equal division of the late Bharati Shroff’s equity stake. Bharati Shroff also held a stake in the firm’s Delhi offices, held by a separate company, which was willed to Shardul.

According to ET:

The petition, which was filed on Friday, is the denouement of a dispute which has simmered for months and had become common knowledge in Mumbai’s corporate, banking and legal circles. Two of India’s top bankers and a number of top industrialists are said to have acted as mediators in an attempt to resolve the matter. These attempts appear to have failed, at least for now…

The ownership dispute has been discussed by members of Amarchand Mangaldas’ management committee, according to people familiar with the matter. Two independent members (the committee has seven members in all), George Golding and James Abraham, recently moved a resolution that there cannot be ambiguity in the ownership of the firm and on principle of equality, Bharti Shroff’s shares should be distributed equally between the two managing partners.

They also contended that family matters should not have any consequence for the firm. Sources said the resolution, which was circulated over email earlier this week, was passed 5:2 in Cyril Shroff’s favour. Cyril declined comment on the resolution.

MSM wave 2 (Update 4 & 5)

Two further mainstream publications, the Business Standard and the Indian Express, covered the dispute late yesterday and this morning, respectively.

The Express reported that the first hearing in the case is scheduled to take place in 14 days.

However, the cause list for the Bombay high court has listed it as the sixth matter on Tuesday, 18 November, in court number 8 before Justice RD Dhanuka (hat-tip @ProphetRafiki on Twitter).

Update 1: Case details added.

Update 2: Meenaka Doshi blog post added

Update 3 (15 November 10:21): MSM coverage details added

Update 4 (16 November): Express coverage and hearing in 14 days

Update 5: Corrected: Next hearing on Tuesday

Comments

Anon 14 Nov 2014, 15:19
+38 -28
:O :O
Diff Anon - smartest lawyer 16 Nov 2014, 09:40
+43 -27
This was expected - just shows the only thing holding the Mumbai and Delhi branches together was Bharati Shroff the matriarch. This is life.

Perhaps its best they go their separate ways. There is no way the next generation of the two family branches can manage the firm's affairs jointly in future.

Right now its a bicycle, for the next generation, it would become a tractor with 5 or more tyres. Over the next two decades the family bus would have had 9 tyres and steering wheels.

Probably for the best.
Mlin 14 Nov 2014, 15:20
+53 -32
this is going to be fun. given each side's propensity to start gossip.

Moonshot-
If it splits and bombay amss decides to open up delhi office (hopefully not in gurgaon), it will be a nice new option in Delhi.
Duhh 15 Nov 2014, 07:25
+28 -25
I am not a huge fan of AMSS, but I think it is unnecessarily sadistic to say that this will be fun. Think about all the people who associate themselves with the AMSS brand. One only hopes that the brothers will see how together they are a much stronger and better force.
Mlin 15 Nov 2014, 07:52
+26 -21
I am an estate tax supporter. Just so you know the way my sympathies for big monies lie.
Roby 14 Nov 2014, 15:21
+22 -2
Flesh and blood,
You, brother mine, that entertain'd ambition,
Expell'd remorse and nature, who, with Sebastian-
Whose inward pinches therefore are most strong-
Would here have kill'd your king, I do forgive thee,
Unnatural though thou art.
(William Shakespeare)
thinking 14 Nov 2014, 15:30
+5 -6
Wondering if MP involved in any manner? Somebody may just check the BHC site to see the lawyers Shardul / Cyril are using!
Court Witness 14 Nov 2014, 15:35
+9 -2
Ofcourse!!! It's filed through Bharucha & Partners
Records will tumble 14 Nov 2014, 15:30
+22 -5
This story will certainly break LI records for the most comments!!!!!!
Moh Maya 14 Nov 2014, 15:33
+6 -0
It is the beginning of the end of an era.
Court Witness 14 Nov 2014, 15:35
+1 -5
The case is SL/1072/2014 and Shardul will seek his pound of flesh through Bharucha & Partners. Maybe Kian you should get comments from there too.
Bombay Lawyer 14 Nov 2014, 15:37
+3 -4
Matter Numbers

Civil Suit No. S(L) 1072 of 2014, Notice of Motion NMSL 2559/2014 along with Testamentary Petition No TPL/1864/2014 before the High Court of Judicature at Bombay.


Advocates on Record of Shardul Suresh Shroff: Baruch & Partners
A sad state of affairs 14 Nov 2014, 15:39
+7 -6
First it was JB Dadachanji & Co, now AMSS. End of an era?
No chance 14 Nov 2014, 15:51
+21 -21
Amss is too mighty to fall. Will be an out of court settlement.
Duhh 15 Nov 2014, 07:26
+1 -4
Fully agreed!
Bombay Lawyer 14 Nov 2014, 15:54
+3 -1
They have filed an NMS. Some judges are sitting tomorrow. I think they will mention the matter tomorrow. They have filed all their cases today. It looks like the notice served today was notice of their mentioning the matter. Matter should come before Dhanuka J (Cr 20 Court No.9) as per sitting list. Its not there on the cause list at all. So I'm guessing they will seek circulation tomorrow.

Fun times.
DBS 15 Nov 2014, 05:39
+8 -1
Dhanuka J. sits in Courtroom 10. That's where all the action will be next week. Yay!!!!!!!!!!
Although would have preferred the matter before Gautam Patel J. !!
AMSS aspirant... 14 Nov 2014, 15:55
+12 -4
laroo sab milke......want to see open debate in tv between two brothers.........
Lawyer 14 Nov 2014, 15:56
+35 -7
yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy. Markets will open sooner now!!! #divideandrule
Bond 14 Nov 2014, 16:03
+1 -2
No way, boss, both brothers will still oppose that. If anything, there will be one more player against it after a split, if that happens.
Roadies 14 Nov 2014, 15:59
+41 -10
If anyone can destroy Shroff's, it's themselves. So looking forward to [...] the comments. This is so much fun. Like RIL and ADAG, one will remain "Amarchand Mangaldas" and other will come "Amarchand Mangalas - A Truly Professional Firm"!

Ha ha ....
Guest 18 Nov 2014, 05:04
+0 -1
Executor, and also sole beneficiary!
arnab 14 Nov 2014, 16:01
+7 -4
This is News hour stuff!
Lol 14 Nov 2014, 16:02
+7 -6
The Ambanis of the corporate legal world!
Bhasin 14 Nov 2014, 16:04
+26 -11
Lalit Bhasin should intervene. This can open the Indian legal market. Luthra is on a downhill already.

Achche din aane wale hain.....

God Bless India
bhasin 2 15 Nov 2014, 13:04
+4 -0
where does luthra come in this??? your application to them got rejected?
How can Lalit Bhasin intervene in what is clearly a family dispute matter, you moron??
Original Bhasin 15 Nov 2014, 13:31
+2 -1
[quote name="bhasin 2"]where does luthra come in this??? your application to them got rejected?
How can Lalit Bhasin intervene in what is clearly a family dispute matter, you moron??[/quote]

Clearly you don't have taste for sarcasm.
Wokil 14 Nov 2014, 16:09
+5 -0
This won't be a news for insiders ..!!! Anyone working always knew, off late, it's going to happen..!!
Mlin 14 Nov 2014, 16:17
+5 -0
Of course. Insiders are always ahead. But whats the point of knowing if you cant talk about it. Which no one has been doing. Its not like being an insider means that they share any of that dough.
NN 14 Nov 2014, 16:22
+26 -9
JSA increasingly leaderless. AZB, overly dependent on one person, Luthra, on the way down. Who's left?
silent viiewer 14 Nov 2014, 16:22
+17 -13
AJ quits AZB!

Cyril sues Shardul!

KCO & JSA... Good times!
Wrong View 14 Nov 2014, 16:37
+17 -17
[quote name="silent viiewer"]AJ quits AZB!

Cyril sues Shardul!

KCO & JSA... Good times![/quote]

Shardul sues Cyril and not the other way

JSA is down.

Khaitan with its perseverance becomes leader of the pack.

Legal market opens up.
Haha 15 Nov 2014, 05:56
+27 -7
TTA, S&R and Platinum. Time for the new, professional firms to start dominating.
how? 16 Nov 2014, 11:06
+4 -14
TTA, S&R and Platinum cannot compete since they are only boutique firms unlike AMSS, AZB, JSA, KCO etc which are full service firms.
Watch 16 Nov 2014, 14:59
+17 -3
The full service firms give half service and the boutique firms give full service.

Not an unfair question and I think the smaller firms (not just the ones mentioned) will keep growing in their areas of specialisation.
Reality Check 15 Nov 2014, 15:51
+42 -4
All the other indian firms would have to vanish from the face of the earth for a firm like KCO to be the leading firm!!
Bravo 16 Nov 2014, 07:28
+32 -3
Exactly! .. Khaitan supporters (the very few that there are) stop trying to randomly keep mentioning the firm here.. Such behaviour only reinforces that as khaitan can't achieve success on its own merit like a vulture it needs to feed of other peoples misery!
Butme? 17 Nov 2014, 08:15
+3 -7
Dude Trilegal's still there with a strong partnership - wouldn't be surprised if they make a play for some of the (un)happy partners.
Common sense 17 Nov 2014, 12:22
+11 -1
@butme - Trilegal is not making a play anywhere (unless it's football)! Can't afford intelligent partners even if they are in the market.. the existing legends in the firm will feel threatened. Directionless.
Tri Legal 17 Nov 2014, 13:01
+1 -0
True that
Disgust 14 Nov 2014, 16:22
+16 -9
[...] File a suit against your own brother, your own flesh and blood? [...] if you cannot value family, what use is any of your riches, your success, your life? [...]
Mangaldas Mehta 14 Nov 2014, 16:37
+7 -7
On branding- who keeps Amarchand? who keep Suresh A.Shroff? and what happens to Mangaldas?
Gopaldas ChandniChowkwaala 14 Nov 2014, 17:37
+26 -3
Itni jaaldi kaayki...Aaram se maje le
Dude 15 Nov 2014, 05:53
+14 -4
Doesn't matter. Cyril is like Angel Di Maria. His brother is that hapless right back who will only get run down.
Sympathy 14 Nov 2014, 16:43
+53 -5
Poor Slaughter & May and BCG guys.
why sympathy ? 15 Nov 2014, 05:33
+4 -3
not sure of Slaughter and May.

but have worked with BCG and the likes. their billings would put lawyers to shame.

having said that, at this level, money will not been the main issue. So yes, sympathies and best wishes for the new bentley to the consultants.
LOL 14 Nov 2014, 16:46
+21 -1
This is what happens when you resist globalisation and try to follow a family business model. This is also the perfect time for foreign law firms to enter India. Their biggest opponents are at their weakest, so strike now!
DBS 14 Nov 2014, 16:55
+5 -3
Reminds me of the dispute among Equity Partners in Crawford Bayley more than a decade back!!
Although there were no family relations among them!!
anony 15 Nov 2014, 05:34
+1 -2
Can you share the story.

maybe as an anony blog ?
amss guy 14 Nov 2014, 17:05
+79 -8
@Kian: Does 'breaking' in the title refer to the freshness of the news, or to the current status of the firm? :P
Lebron James 14 Nov 2014, 17:08
+3 -2
Oooooooooooooh. This is big yao!
Guest 14 Nov 2014, 17:19
+6 -3
I am hoping for the rest of the profession that their fight is too big to settle.
BHOnsle 14 Nov 2014, 17:19
+17 -2
Hildul is rocking.. less revenues and wants equal share.. Cyril will fight...
hille re 14 Nov 2014, 18:05
+4 -3
If shardul is suing with the will, then likely that will gives him more than equal? Don't know about revenues, but likely that Cyril will be fighting for, and not against equal.
VISHI 16 Nov 2014, 13:31
+3 -0
Since when does AMSS care about equal share for equal revenues?
Observer 14 Nov 2014, 17:20
+4 -4
Hope the brothers have the wisdom to settle their disputes soon enough and not make this a public spectacle. They have advised large business families in similar situations and should put such advice to personal use
que sera sera 15 Nov 2014, 04:14
+9 -0
Who gives a shizz yo! On the contrary I hope this goes on for sometime and we get our regular dose of goss and personally a distraction from my SEBI filings!
Gossipmonger 14 Nov 2014, 17:23
+13 -5
In one sense LI has also become a platform for lawyers to gossip, pass funny comments, be sarcastic, et al. This one is going to be the biggest pastime over LI for lawyers. And given the comments so far, it is so obvious how much people distaste AMSS - almost everyone seemed to be excited with the news!
Curious Cat 14 Nov 2014, 18:51
+8 -14
Has it occurred to you that those who do not *distaste* AMSS have better things to do than to upload bitchy comments secure in their anonymity? Do something meaningful with your life. Something seriously wrong when people find so much joy in other people's troubles.
Gossipmonger 14 Nov 2014, 20:28
+2 -5
So what did you find bitchy in my comment? Curious me!
Curious Cat 15 Nov 2014, 05:13
+4 -5
Use your head please. We were talking about the comments being made by people on this site.
Nirmal Baba 15 Nov 2014, 07:33
+3 -0
Aaj ka suvichaar
Chyawanprash baba 15 Nov 2014, 10:00
+2 -2
It's funny let us have fun.... There is a reason why reading comments on LI is optional. More importantly, have some chyawaprash.
SAD 14 Nov 2014, 17:23
+33 -26
What a day! Two brothers, both brilliant, made an institution. Changed the legal industry in India. They gave law students a platform to become lawyers and become well known in their own fields. Vichu, Uma, Rahul Guptan, Ashwath, Gunjan, Jatin,etc, etc. So many have had so much to gain from them for so long. Yet, the comments are primarily from those who are enjoying their decline. They have obviously been drifting apart for a long long time but that they would provide the nay sayers such an opportunity is a surprise and a shame.

Hope there is still a chance of not splitting the Firm. Hope they still can salvage this and go back to sanity.
Emotional Guy 14 Nov 2014, 17:35
+49 -21
[quote name="SAD"]What a day! Two brothers, both brilliant, made an institution. Changed the legal industry in India. They gave law students a platform to become lawyers and become well known in their own fields. Vichu, Uma, Rahul Guptan, Ashwath, Gunjan, Jatin,etc, etc. So many have had so much to gain from them for so long. Yet, the comments are primarily from those who are enjoying their decline. They have obviously been drifting apart for a long long time but that they would provide the nay sayers such an opportunity is a surprise and a shame.

Hope there is still a chance of not splitting the Firm. Hope they still can salvage this and go back to sanity.[/quote]

Spare us with your emotional atyachar!
Guest 15 Nov 2014, 05:14
+2 -0
from*
AC 14 Nov 2014, 18:31
+28 -3
Ashurst and Chadbourne & Park wanted to enter India way back in 1994. Had these guys been not preventing the liberalisation of the legal market, job market would have been much better by now.
Khalnayak 17 Nov 2014, 14:27
+3 -0
Bhai, tu SAD hai ya Senior Associate Designate? Relax, man. Suck up in February like everyone else.
FYI 14 Nov 2014, 17:27
+59 -8
Kian is an Amarchand agent, he is not revealing all latest developments. Amarchand is going to split
kianganz 15 Nov 2014, 07:20
+11 -2
An agent for which side?

But seriously, I think it's far too early to conclude they will definitely split.

The possibility that they will split is real of course, but so is the pragmatism that has kept the bicycle working so long and as well as it has been.
Agent Kian 15 Nov 2014, 12:22
+7 -0
Disagree Kian.

I think the split is imminent now, given that the publicity this issue has got. Its just a matter of time. RIP AMSS
Saddist Vakeel 15 Nov 2014, 07:48
+1 -0
LoLs! Agents of Delhi or Mumbai?
Shameful 14 Nov 2014, 17:27
+9 -3
So much for a "family" run firm! Is this the idea of family? One must wonder why they did not attempt to resolve the dispute in a more private fashion - and instead chose to air their dirty laundry out in public. Truly shameful!
Guest 14 Nov 2014, 17:27
+15 -88
Luthra will be no 1 now
Mlin 14 Nov 2014, 17:32
+40 -7
i just noticed the sepia pics of each of them at the start of this article. wish them 20 years of courts ka chakkar for looking so smug in these pics.
Happy 14 Nov 2014, 17:34
+2 -3
:)
100 Comments Fan 14 Nov 2014, 18:18
+4 -4
This will be the fastest LI article to reach the [b]100 comments mark[/b].
200 comments fan 15 Nov 2014, 09:36
+3 -2
Come on guys! One last push!
Baba 14 Nov 2014, 18:18
+8 -2
They had it, probably they will see the same end as Crawford or Fox Mandal. Jumping ships will be a smart move now!
Great news! 14 Nov 2014, 18:22
+29 -6
Wooohooo! Foreign law firms will come in now!

Wooohooo! Foreign law firms will come in now!

Wooohooo! Foreign law firms will come in now!

Very happy at this news. May all such feudal family law firms fall apart.
Chaiwala 15 Nov 2014, 05:20
+10 -2
Like you'll get a job in either a foreign firm or a feudal firm. other than serving tea coffee with me.
Happy Happy 14 Nov 2014, 18:34
+39 -1
Great news. Not because of what will happen in the next 5-7 years but what will happen after Cyril, Shardul, Pallavi and Vandana retire but because of long term ramifications. The next generation (kids+naval) is deeply involved in the firm and the expectation is that they would take over the management. Everyone knows the next generation is ineffective and not even close to Cyril and Shardul's brilliance. It would have been difficult for the other partners in the firm to upstage them but the break-up will help.
Troll 14 Nov 2014, 18:35
+32 -2
Kian, can you keep a small award for the best comment?
kianganz 15 Nov 2014, 07:14
+36 -3
A drink on me at the next Legally Social, for whoever dares own up to best comment there?
Curious Cat 15 Nov 2014, 07:44
+2 -0
When is the next LegallySocial? When? When?
Agent Kian 15 Nov 2014, 12:24
+3 -1
I think Shardul and Cyril should be invited for the next Legally Social and Kian should mediate over some single Malt and Aam Ras
Duhh 15 Nov 2014, 11:07
+1 -1
One drink aint gonna cut it...small award taken literally Kian
Amss guy 15 Nov 2014, 12:12
+2 -1
Kian,

I want more than a drink. May be, a part of the equity that they are fighting over!
Uth Jao 16 Nov 2014, 03:32
+1 -0
Chalo beta jaldi utho! no more dreaming! time for school
Irony man 14 Nov 2014, 18:54
+3 -1
To think they have advised tens of Indian families about exactly such situations!! I hope wise counsel prevails and they bury the hatchet soon.
Misery loves company 14 Nov 2014, 18:56
+12 -8
There sure is a lot of Schadenfreude on display here tonight.

For those who are ready to talk a little bit of sense, I think it's far too early to write off the Shroffs, let alone Amarchand. Warts and all, they have built an institution that is nearly unrivalled in the market.

The brothers are also too shrewd and have smart enough people around them to just throw all that away.

Granted, the bad blood runs deeply, but my guess is that common sense will ultimately prevail here.
Sad Reality 15 Nov 2014, 00:18
+34 -1
Let me say upfront:

1. I hope you are right.
2. I have neither any information nor any knowledge of the facts other than what's been reported by Kian and Menaka.
3. I am not from Amarchand.

Here is why I think a split is inevitable now:

The dispute is about stake in the partnership and if Shardul gets 22% more he will be at 40% to Cyril's 22%. It's common knowledge that Mumbai region (Mumbai +Hyderabad + Bangalore) contributes much more to the revenue than the Delhi region. If Shardul gets the injunction today or on Monday, then essentially Cyril will be earning most of the money and yet he would have to give Shardul 22% more than what he can give himself. Why would he do that? Even for a single day. Any invoices outstanding which come into the firm now will actually be subject to a dispute. So, Cyril, the smartest of them all, shouldn't be expected to expose himself to the situation.

Will be surprised if Cyril doesn't split the Firm before Monday and makes sure that no client pays any more money into the existing Firm.

Hope it doesn't happen but it looks inevitable and imminent.
eat happily 15 Nov 2014, 06:41
+4 -2
Amss should take a cue from wadia. Eat what you kill..
Chyawanprash baba 15 Nov 2014, 10:05
+10 -0
Cue from wadia.... Seriously????.... In the Eat what you kill process.... Other firms have taken away their talented associates/ partners and now Wadia is the best example of a sinking ship.
LIT_Lawyer 14 Nov 2014, 19:10
+4 -1
Someone plz call arnab ...

"Lawyers need to know shroffs... Indian lawyers need to know when are you filing some winding up petitions...:p"
bling 14 Nov 2014, 19:28
+79 -2
The front wheel of the bicycle just f*****g came off
The Nation Wants To Know 14 Nov 2014, 19:34
+4 -1
This is Super Primetime News
Hildul 14 Nov 2014, 19:37
+20 -2
Hildul has finally lost it. This is not good for the legal fraternity and industry. It will polarise people. Berlin wall of Bombay and Delhi. Absolutely senseless to drag in the management committee of independent people who were acting n the best interests of the firm, Cyril will prevail.
Troll 14 Nov 2014, 20:24
+29 -12
So Shradul should have sued a firm without suing its partners. *slow clap*
--- 15 Nov 2014, 05:12
+29 -6
Read carefully, the comment was about dragging independent members of the management committee in the matter. As you may or may not be aware, independent members of management committee are not partners.

trolling without reading or understanding. *more slow clap*.
Curious Cat 15 Nov 2014, 06:29
+25 -2
This Hildul name is too good. I think as a legal community we should re-christen shardul.
Chyawanprash baba 15 Nov 2014, 10:06
+2 -0
Tathastu!!! Ho gaya!!
Outsider 15 Nov 2014, 16:26
+17 -0
Currently, for their own sake, maybe Miljul is a better option.
Curious Cat 15 Nov 2014, 17:54
+0 -1
Love this comment.
Guest 14 Nov 2014, 20:23
+3 -3
Earlier Gagrat & Co aslo had sema problem . CA firm Nanubhai & Co had dispute betwen father nad the son Darshan and Shantunu Desai
Dude 15 Nov 2014, 05:18
+15 -1
sema problem, anna?
Curious Cat 15 Nov 2014, 08:11
+5 -0
It works if you write *aslo* before that and *betwen* and *nad* afterwards.
Anon 15 Nov 2014, 15:09
+2 -0
it totally works :)
Splitsville 14 Nov 2014, 21:06
+12 -2
Amss split seems inevitable. AZB Mumbai is likely to lose further partners after Abhijit Joshi.

More options for Junior lawyers. Rise. You have a chance to get out of the trenches. Your time has come.
Curious Cat 15 Nov 2014, 08:12
+2 -2
Why will AZB lose partners after Abhijit Joshi? Care to elaborate?
AZB GUY 16 Nov 2014, 11:09
+5 -0
The law firm which builds by poaching is on the prowl again. Wait and watch. AJ might also join them.
Curious Cat 16 Nov 2014, 13:07
+9 -0
The Shaitans are here?
The Horse Whisperer 14 Nov 2014, 23:42
+4 -4
This seems a little sad. The brothers should settle the dispute as quickly as possible and move forward. We lawyers will not give our clients great confidence when we fight amongst ourselves. The outcome will not be good for the legal profession in India, if the matter is not resolved quickly.
Horse- or Donkey.. 15 Nov 2014, 02:57
+2 -2
Lawyers are respected as 'effective' when they emerge from BLOODY conflicts... and this IS gonna be one.

Cyril is on the ascendancy because of the Adanis and Modi etc.. Shardul had his time with PNB [...] - but has no 'real' political clout left (no point in being a Trustee on an Ex-PM's Trust, eh?!?).

So, please read the writing on the wall, Big Brother!

As for your whispering to Horse/s, only a Donkey would find the "not be good for the legal profession in India" appealing..
wtf?! 15 Nov 2014, 03:41
+16 -11
It will help the legal profession greatly! More startup law firms will spring up. Firms like JSA, KCo, WG etc which believe in meritocracy (and not chamcha culture) will thrive. Foreign law firms might finally come in generating employment for 1200+ N-law grads passing every year. Bring in the gloves!
Haha 15 Nov 2014, 16:58
+40 -2
I think u are truly mistaken - Chamcha culture is all that works at khaitan!
Outsider 18 Nov 2014, 03:43
+4 -0
KCO believing in meritocracy? Have I mistakenly woken up in an alternate universe?
Nostradamus 15 Nov 2014, 02:10
+4 -22
They will settle...United or divided Amarchand will rock... Competitors of Amss watch out... Things will only get difficult for them ... People who are predicting soon - wishful thinking
CultureVulture 15 Nov 2014, 06:23
+4 -0
Dude, instead of pelting out platitude disguised as prophecies, just read the article and apply your head? One managing partner of a firm is suing the other. How exactly does it make life difficult for AMSSs' competitors? Unless of course you count AMSS-D and AMSS-B as competitors!
Nostradamus 15 Nov 2014, 07:33
+5 -1
Competitors have one more tier 1 firm to contend with. If that ain't a problem, what is?
Ex amss 15 Nov 2014, 03:13
+10 -2
The true culture of the firm is finally out ... For all those amss loyalists ... Do u guys really have anything more to say????
Respect 15 Nov 2014, 04:02
+44 -32
Cyril's statement in the Economic Times is befitting of a man of his stature, while Shardul's actions are befitting of a man of his stature. Class and confidence emanate from Cyril's conduct. He doesn't need to wash dirty linen in public. Shardul has taken on the smartest legal brain in the country and then found lawyers who have a grudge against Cyril. Personal petty vendetta will not override fundamental principles of contract. Shardul will look foolish.
lawlzees 15 Nov 2014, 05:08
+36 -5
What about fundamental rules of testamentary succession? He can outsmart them too?
anony 15 Nov 2014, 05:49
+1 -2
totally nailed it!

but here's a doubt.

Law is many times about things apart from justice and who gets it.
Mr. X 15 Nov 2014, 06:07
+1 -1
Brilliant! Made by day!
Anon 15 Nov 2014, 06:25
+2 -0
The issue is does the will over-ride the partnership agreement. In law this would appear to be the case, unless Bharti Shroff's ownership of equity was not absolute ownership and was hers only during her lifetime with no freedom to bequeath.
Boo Hoo 15 Nov 2014, 09:34
+2 -0
But if she contractually agreed to a certain manner of disposition will an unilateral will override that?
Anon 15 Nov 2014, 11:02
+10 -0
Exactly, question is was her equity ownership absolute with freedom to bequeath at will or was it a lifetime interest that would devolve upon the sons equally. Also, a partnership contract requires consent. Can a share in a partnership be bequeathed? Could one argue that her share should be distributed between all remaining partners pari passu based upon existing percentages, i.e., in the same proportion. Besides the family arrangement, there is a partnership contract including non family partners. What happens in the case of shares of a non family partner passing away? It likely goes back to the rest pari passu, maybe or to the family. Can a single partner posthumously and unilaterally alter a partnership contract through a will.

The interpretation of the relevant partnership clause would affect all partners perhaps.
Guest 15 Nov 2014, 13:12
+1 -0
I don't think that a will can override the terms of a partnership deed
Anon 15 Nov 2014, 13:29
+1 -0
From the LI article and updates, it is not completely clear if the provision that Bharti Shroff's shares would go to Shardul & Cyril in equal parts, was in the family agreement or in the registered partnership deed. It seems as if this was in the family agreement only.
The legal relationship if any between the family arrangement and partnership deed is not known to us. Perhaps the partnership deed acknowledged and accepted the over-riding applicability of the family arrangement. Though this is unlikely. The family arrangement might not have been disclosed to non family partners.
I am starting to wonder if non family partners could claim a part of Bharti Shroff's equity.
I by the way am the lawyer who commented earlier that I had the best legal brains in the country.
Guest 15 Nov 2014, 13:53
+3 -0
yes sir .. you clearly "had" the best legal brain. Sad to know that you have lost your brains now
Anon 15 Nov 2014, 14:55
+1 -2
You got me there - The past tense referred to my comment, but let me state again, I have the best legal brain in the country, in my opinion that is.
Anon 15 Nov 2014, 16:13
+4 -1
I,the one with the smartest legal brain in the country have cracked this on first principles. It all depends upon the partnership deed and whatever that states on how Bharati's equity goes will prevail. At the moment of Bharati Shroff's passing away, her estate in the firm only stood at whatever money was due towards her share. Her partnership rights dissolved at the moment of her passing. She could therefore only have bequeathed the moneys receivable but not her equity.

Now the question is does the partnership agreement contain adequate guidance on who will get Bharati Shroff's share or is it silent? Does the Family arrangement specify this? Is the family arrangement binding on the surviving partnership?

If the partnership agreement does not specify how Bharati Shroff's share will be divided, then all partners (family and non family) might be entitled to a proportional share. Hows that?
RP 15 Nov 2014, 18:45
+1 -1
[quote name="Anon"]Exactly, question is was her equity ownership absolute with freedom to bequeath at will or was it a lifetime interest that would devolve upon the sons equally. Also, a partnership contract requires consent. Can a share in a partnership be bequeathed? Could one argue that her share should be distributed between all remaining partners pari passu based upon existing percentages, i.e., in the same proportion. Besides the family arrangement, there is a partnership contract including non family partners. What happens in the case of shares of a non family partner passing away? It likely goes back to the rest pari passu, maybe or to the family. Can a single partner posthumously and unilaterally alter a partnership contract through a will.

The interpretation of the relevant partnership clause would affect all partners perhaps.[/quote]

Wo sab to thik hai bhai saab par aapne law kahan se kiya hai?
Anon 16 Nov 2014, 04:44
+5 -0
Bhai Saab, LLB to Dilli univ se kiya. CLC. 1995 quallified, worst possible teachers, terrible teaching methods, expected to memorize and cite full citations, bad attendance record for bad teachers

But except for a few good teachers, I consider myself self-taught, recall reading British law text books from British Council library during LLB years, and then taught myself on the job

Good brain, good language skills, clear thinking, good comprehension, enjoy reading, so law khudi seekh liya.

Am now the smartest legal brain in the country. Always was.
Anon 16 Nov 2014, 05:39
+1 -0
From 1992-19995, the only 2 CLC teachers who made me think in class, were M P Singh (Consti) and M C Sharma (contract).

Actually the Hindu law teacher (one Mr Gupta, i think) was also good.

A few teachers were average & boring, [reading from copious pre-prepared notes which everyone else copied down in class (but not me)], though they did not make fools of themselves.

The rest were jokers, the IP law classes had me in splits for things like "loin" instead of "lion".
Guest 17 Nov 2014, 06:16
+0 -0
[quote name="Anon"]From 1992-19995, the only 2 CLC teachers who made me think in class, were M P Singh (Consti) and M C Sharma (contract).

Actually the Hindu law teacher (one Mr Gupta, i think) was also good.

A few teachers were average & boring, [reading from copious pre-prepared notes which everyone else copied down in class (but not me)], though they did not make fools of themselves.

The rest were jokers, the IP law classes had me in splits for things like "loin" instead of "lion".[/quote]

Why are you tooting your own horn?
smartest legal brain 17 Nov 2014, 08:53
+0 -1
no, exposing CLC
tooting horn 17 Nov 2014, 17:35
+0 -0
Denny Crane!
MP Singh Fan 18 Nov 2014, 07:21
+0 -0
MP saab also taught me. He had an awesome accent.
Mlin 15 Nov 2014, 05:21
+6 -0
what do you think shardul should have done. not follow [Bharati's] will? leave aside a hundreds of crores of revenue?

the only person who has [made a mistake is Bharati Shroff]. why have such random contradictions between will and agreement. From that moment this was bound to happen, as will the split eventually now (as there will be loss of face for shardul if he settles, and loss of revenue for cyril if he doesn't).
Saddist Vakeel 15 Nov 2014, 07:49
+22 -3
Probably she did not get proper legal counsel :-(
Scooter- 16 Nov 2014, 13:31
+5 -3
ya, Luthra didnt have bandwidth to take her matter.
Anon 15 Nov 2014, 06:22
+19 -8
Who decided that Cyril was the smartest legal brain in the country? You have proof of this? I find such statements amusing. I think I am the smartest legal brain in the country.

One day its Salve, or Cyril, or Nariman, or Zia etc etc etc
contract v. succession 15 Nov 2014, 07:02
+8 -0
Contract law cannot overide law of succession....
Guest 15 Nov 2014, 13:14
+4 -0
and where do you get this authority? can you please cite
old furniture 16 Nov 2014, 14:58
+3 -1
you can bequeath only what you retain. If you have given something away, it no longer remains with you to bequeath
Concerned 15 Nov 2014, 07:39
+10 -3
Cyril has got the best law firm in Mumbai and possibly one of the best in the Country to represent him. Its a battle of of the titans in terms of clients and firms.
Curious Cat 15 Nov 2014, 08:15
+7 -4
Federal and Rashmikant? Best law firm? Really?
Concerned 15 Nov 2014, 09:55
+16 -1
Err Yes. Name the biggest matter in BHC today and they're representing one of the main parties. Yes Bank, NSEL, Supermax to name a few. Why else would Cyril go to them?

Just that they are low profile and don't go about promoting themselves aggressively ..but brilliant nonetheless.
Concerned 2 15 Nov 2014, 17:01
+13 -2
I agree with Concerned. Federal & Rashmikant is easily the best law firm in the country. They are involved in and have won some of the biggest matters not only in the BHC but also the Supreme Court. Right from BALCO to Supermax to Yes Bank they have done a great job! Federal & Rashmikant doesn't need to go around promoting themselves, their work speaks for them!
Curious Cat 15 Nov 2014, 17:58
+1 -1
I stand corrected. Sorry. I didn't know. I assume this is only for litigation yes? Do they have a transactional practice too?
Concerned 15 Nov 2014, 18:47
+4 -2
Litigation and real estate. Wouldn't put brilliant transactional work past them given an opportunity..I don't think they take on much due to their lit practice, but I could be wrong. Anyone knows better?
Concerned 2 15 Nov 2014, 20:07
+5 -1
They do have very good real estate work too. Federal handles real estate and Rashmikant handles litigation.
Concerned 3 16 Nov 2014, 02:57
+4 -0
Fair to say one of the best law firms for litigation in Bombay High Court, anything beyond that is speculation and not really relevant- Ironical to see that Cyril, for all his commitment to "full service" biglaw and stated disdain for niche practices, chooses a niche litigation firm for his own matter... hypocracy much?
Concerned 16 Nov 2014, 05:44
+6 -0
When it comes to yourself, you would only want the best na?! AMSS clients should really sit up and take note of this hypocrisy!
anon 16 Nov 2014, 06:20
+4 -1
dont see it as ironical. It could also be the fact that Cyril may not want his partners and associates to get involved in his personal family disputes. An outside law firm will provide client attorney privilege.
DBS 17 Nov 2014, 09:46
+3 -0
'Best LITIGATION Law Firm. yes,perhaps!!
Guest 16 Nov 2014, 18:32
+4 -3
Insider view is that federal was chosen because of the friendship he has with cyril ..they are friends since law school.. Cyril has a good litigation team at amss which will do the ground work and has a good line up of senior counsels, but since another firm has to represent them he has chosen a friend who he would be comfortable sharing facts with .. That's all!
But but 16 Nov 2014, 19:48
+6 -1
Federal doesn't even do lit matters! It's Rashmikant who heads the litigation team. Inside news is that Cyril and Rashmikant did NOT go to school college law college or practice in the same place. Cyril went to fnr because.. Well because fnr too good lit practice karta hain boss.
... Brothers 15 Nov 2014, 04:03
+4 -1
Even as we speak, both brothers are busy blocking senior counsel in Bombay. Cyril has a clear advantage on home turf. I'm told he has already blocked the regulars briefed by AMSS Bombay. It will be interesting to see who finally represents them in court. And whether Shardul brings in someone from Delhi.
Alligator 15 Nov 2014, 04:53
+15 -1
Why would Shardul not use Pallavi to argue in court. Unless AMSS Delhi litigation practice not as strong as they project it to be..
Scooter- 15 Nov 2014, 07:15
+24 -2
coz alan shore argued for denny crane and not he himself
Scooter- 15 Nov 2014, 14:42
+12 -2
mere do kaudi ki prophecy

Cyril challenges will. Framework agreement overrides will. Framework agreement enforced- 22 pc split bw the two. AMSS remains one in name. with distinct partnerships with the minimal cross partnership to retain nexus. This cross partnership will be structured in some way without any voting rights. Geographical practice to be retained. No/minimal referrals. No one opens an office in others city but free to do matters or approach clients. Goes back to pre-BCG era. Mumbai does better than Delhi and for obvious reasons.

#justsaying
Bad form 15 Nov 2014, 06:00
+16 -2
no one has made any comment on the fact that MP Bharucha is acting for one partner against another partner of his former firm. That seems a little unusual to me.
have posted earlr but Anon now 15 Nov 2014, 06:05
+3 -3
nothing wrong with that. at all.

and best person indeed. Must know that partnership deed inside out.
The insider 15 Nov 2014, 07:57
+39 -2
MP is planning to merger with Shardul to open their Mumbai office post the split!
Chyawanprash babas 15 Nov 2014, 10:08
+5 -1
Very good inside news/ speculation......first useful comment
Expert 15 Nov 2014, 06:09
+14 -0
[quote name="Bad form"]no one has made any comment on the fact that MP Bharucha is acting for one partner against another partner of his former firm. That seems a little unusual to me.[/quote]

MP is like Vibhishan", Ghar Ka Bhedi Lanka Dhaye....
Saddist Vakeel 15 Nov 2014, 07:50
+3 -2
What about 'ethics' and 'conflict'?
Scooter- 16 Nov 2014, 13:43
+5 -2
MP to AB: Hey, a new mandates Justin.

AB to MP: Oh wow! whose the client?
MP: Hildul
AB: cough cough! what!! Sadhubaba?! whats he coming to us for? Be careful, it must be a ploy!These Shroffs I tell you!
MP: Dont worry, us hildul ko maine (h)alka mein nahi liya hai! S is suing C!! Evil laughter!! For their equity! haha, the one which we had! par gabbar ne mere haath kaat liye!
AB: Ok..koi nahi...Jai aur Veeru ko bulate hai...oops, Jai to chala gaya! Par Veeru kaun banega?

Scene 2: Junior B enters Justin to the scene.

JB: Mein banunga Veeru! Mein aapke khoon ka badla lunga! (does the chandler dance)

MP: AB Darling, can someone get me my cigar?

AB: Oh come on! lets uncork a champagne! Ajj MPuing

MP: How about some apple pie to go with that?

VPB: I'm so done with that pun! Uggh..

(curtains)
MP 15 Nov 2014, 06:05
+1 -1
There are still may Sr. Advocates who greatly respect MP! And why count him out - he is way senior and smarter than many Sr. Advocates - the only persons Sr to him at the bar would be Chagla & Rohitbhai.
Lawyer 15 Nov 2014, 05:57
+2 -4
Sad that the best in the legal business have to go to the Courts to settle their family dispute. Could have settled it without making the dispute public. Client confidence and the proposition that the firm provides seamless service through different territories will be badly hurt. Perhaps the dispute could open up opportunities to the upcoming firms like Khaitan, Trilegal, JSA etc.
Expert 15 Nov 2014, 06:13
+3 -6
[quote name="Lawyer"]Sad that the best in the legal business have to go to the Courts to settle their family dispute. Could have settled it without making the dispute public. Client confidence and the proposition that the firm provides seamless service through different territories will be badly hurt. Perhaps the dispute could open up opportunities to the upcoming firms like Khaitan, Trilegal, JSA etc.[/quote]

Ambani brothers fight did not affected to Reliance's growth and story will get repeated for Amarchand as well. At Amarchand also Growth is Life.
Dimwit 15 Nov 2014, 07:45
+21 -2
Sucking up to your amarchand bosses is also your way of life
Ummm 15 Nov 2014, 08:35
+14 -1
“did not affected” …… may be amarchand is about growth but I do not see it happening for you, Son.
have posted earlr but Anon now 15 Nov 2014, 06:02
+1 -4
Kian, I am not aware but isn't Menaka Doshi (The Firm) very well connected with Cyril (I remember he had a hand when The Firm as a show was launched). Her quote here seems gently tilted.
kianganz 15 Nov 2014, 07:04
+4 -2
I believe they are fairly connected because of the TV show. However, she's also an independent journalist and has her sources and readily admits that it may not be a complete account she is giving. Nevertheless, what she has written sounds like a pretty reasonable account and quite closely tracks what I've heard and with the ET report...
Desi 15 Nov 2014, 06:07
+49 -3
jo hare use boriya bistar bandh ke himalaya chale jana chahiye, agar khud ka case nahi jeet sakte toh dusre ka kya jeetoge
Scooter- 15 Nov 2014, 07:16
+4 -0
ya- the law works like that.
Arb!? 15 Nov 2014, 07:05
+26 -5
[b]No Arbitration clauses in the partnership agreement or the family framework agreement?[/b]
$ million man 15 Nov 2014, 08:09
+0 -1
that is the question - who in the hell thought that was a good idea?
Agent Kian 15 Nov 2014, 12:26
+0 -0
If yes, was the seat fixed outside India?
Guest 15 Nov 2014, 14:06
+2 -0
Possibly after advising several clients, they realized arbitration is no use, they will end up in courts with the section 9s, 11, 34, 37

Wasn't there news sometime back that Shardul was planning some international arbitration center in delhi? May be he realized the pitfalls of it all
Scooter- 17 Nov 2014, 06:47
+0 -1
There also must be a confidentiality clause! :-)
Lootera 15 Nov 2014, 07:11
+4 -3
It's funny to see how people have completely written off Luthra when they comment on how this fight between the shroff brothers could possibly be an opportunity for other firms. Is it really that bad at luthra or is it just the usual luthra trolling exercise.
CultureVulture 15 Nov 2014, 09:44
+2 -1
A bit of both!
not clear 15 Nov 2014, 13:19
+2 -2
Whats wrong with luthra?
That bad 15 Nov 2014, 13:37
+2 -1
You name it
Guest 17 Nov 2014, 08:17
+0 -1
[quote name="That bad"]You name it[/quote]
Yes, what is happening at Luthra? Why are things so quiet at that end?
Bhooka Nanga 15 Nov 2014, 07:13
+4 -1
What happens to the amarchand aspirants now? Does lateral movement to amarchand make sense now? If yes, which one? Delhi or Mumbai?
Watching from Bombay 15 Nov 2014, 07:30
+4 -1
[b]"Where there is a Will"[/b]........[b]"there is"[/b] litigation.....and...its not the end of the [b]"a way"[/b].....its the beginning of the road to the bank, laughing laughing for a few lawyers.
Curious 15 Nov 2014, 07:39
+7 -2
How much is Bharucha charging AMSS Delhi? It's high time these firms got a taste of their own medicine.
MP - Fees 15 Nov 2014, 07:51
+20 -3
MP must be billing "happiness". Badla Badla Badla
Os 16 Nov 2014, 03:59
+0 -0
I dunno how much they wud have leverage to charge. The client in this case is a very well aware client. Has reach itself in the courts.
FYI 15 Nov 2014, 07:54
+54 -6
Amarchand mukt Bharat by 2020?
Big Daddy 15 Nov 2014, 12:36
+5 -3
Maybe the two Amarchands will be reduced to 44 lawyers each ;)
Scooter- 15 Nov 2014, 14:29
+10 -3
naukri nahi mili na tujhe?
Air BNB 15 Nov 2014, 07:58
+13 -2
I blame Trilegal.
Bombay Lawyer 15 Nov 2014, 08:54
+0 -1
Why?
Air BNB 15 Nov 2014, 10:11
+25 -1
Because they sacked me.
Duhh 15 Nov 2014, 10:16
+1 -0
Just....:)
kapil devil 15 Nov 2014, 13:17
+6 -1
I blame luthra.
Just like that --- seems to be the fashion here.. troll luthra
Guest 17 Nov 2014, 08:18
+1 -0
[quote name="kapil devil"]I blame luthra.
Just like that --- seems to be the fashion here.. troll luthra[/quote]
Why are we trolling Luthra all the time?
Lawyer 15 Nov 2014, 13:27
+5 -0
Third class firm hain, lawyers work out of the basement!!!!
Law-yer 15 Nov 2014, 15:37
+20 -1
in trilegal they work in basement and bask in glory of A&O days
Get a life 21 Nov 2014, 17:51
+0 -0
Gosh, some of you folks are obsessed with Trilegal!
Lebron James 15 Nov 2014, 08:45
+4 -0
Kian:-- You should start a live blog of this event....... instead of this update 1 2, 3 mechanism
Jangli Murga 15 Nov 2014, 10:07
+13 -2
It has been market knowledge for a while that a split was in the offing, with certain people outside the firm having been contacted to set up the Delhi office of the Mumbai firm and vice versa. It appeared that that discussion was progressing (the split) but clearly there are problems with the terms of the aplit.

The bad news for the rest of the top firms is that the two Amarchands are going to furiously undercut each other, driving down fees for the rest as well. At least in the short term.
Jungli Billi 15 Nov 2014, 13:34
+14 -1
Cyril runs a top notch practice. For aloo batata go to Hildul as only the incompetent and insecure undercut on prices.
Legal poet 15 Nov 2014, 10:17
+4 -0
Bharucha be like, "tomorrow it was me, today its you".
Anon 15 Nov 2014, 12:35
+1 -1
yesterday?
Legal poet 15 Nov 2014, 12:59
+0 -1
Oops! Yesterday!
Scooter- 15 Nov 2014, 14:31
+14 -1
legal 'poet'..lol
Concerned 16 Nov 2014, 05:54
+0 -0
Not MP but Cyril could've very well said that to MP when MP "left" AMSS
Chyawanprash babas 15 Nov 2014, 10:23
+1 -0
I wish someone could do a breaking bad meme on this. I would love to see hildul as Walter white
pi 15 Nov 2014, 10:57
+4 -0
winter is coming !!!
NDTV 15 Nov 2014, 10:57
+34 -1
Shradul sues Adani's relative. #BlowToModi
ABC 15 Nov 2014, 14:30
+1 -0
that's the best quote.... perfectly imagine NDTV Bimbos tweeting this..

then that Jain chap will do a Truth or Hype on SSS's Congress connections and Cyril's Sangi roots!
P 15 Nov 2014, 18:38
+6 -1
OK, you liked it but spare us, don't kill the joke. We all get it.
Client of Amarchand 15 Nov 2014, 11:00
+5 -3
Shardul and Cyril should not drag this too much. Both are capable of creating a new legal firms. Amarchand's reputation should be of prime importance. They should try arbitration to keep matters confidential. Let's create great institutions and not single out our wish list. Take care Shroff family.
Guest 15 Nov 2014, 15:35
+5 -4
[quote name="Client of Amarchand"]Shardul and Cyril should not drag this too much. Both are capable of creating a new legal firms. Amarchand's reputation should be of prime importance. They should try arbitration to keep matters confidential. Let's create great institutions and not single out our wish list. Take care Shroff family.[/quote]

That a client of AMSS has advice for the Shroff brothers brings them full circle. Go elsewhere!
Father Brown 15 Nov 2014, 11:14
+17 -5
Kian is it correct that the Delhi office earns lesser revenue than Mumbai? Not too sure abt this esp given that Delhi has litigation, tax, IP, competition etc : more or less absent in Mumbai. The other thing is I am not at all sure this split (inevitable tho it is) will help other law firms : the Delhi ofc will grow stronger in Del and the Mum one in its region....making things more difficult for competitors in those areas. But the shrunk AMSS itself will become a shadow of its former self. So much for the 1000 lawyer dream....The fall of Congress and now imminent fall of AMSS signals the end of dynastic, feudal & sycophancy loving Indian institutions and hopefully heralds the emergence of ones which prioritize merit. And merit ONLY.
anony 15 Nov 2014, 12:46
+5 -1
merit only ?

both AMSSes, post split would fill themselves with sycophants.

What makes you think that a split would breed merit ?
Mlin 15 Nov 2014, 12:48
+3 -3
u mean to say the adani marriage shouldn't be a factor. The bhaichara with Ambani shouldn't be a factor. The Kotak show shouldn't be a factor. all this is merit. their ancestors were more meritorious. Modi coming to the wedding of the century is merit. MERIT ONLY.
Anita 15 Nov 2014, 13:43
+11 -13
Most comments indicate that Luthra is a has been, AZB suffering attrition , KCo and JSA will gain. Interesting that JSA has never created a second line after Berjis, Dina, Som, Amit, Akshay and Farhad. That is where they lose out to Khaitan who will pay a premium and recruit laterals and get in the next generation of big names. Sustainability is a problem not just in family run firms clearly,
ABC 15 Nov 2014, 14:33
+3 -4
Anita aunty please check recent news of hirings, AZB has hired more top names than people who have left them. K&Co has lost a number of partners, Vaishali, Nishant etc...
Desi 15 Nov 2014, 14:52
+5 -6
Akshay, som are part of second line...dina, berjis are the front line...it is the only firm which may gain in the long run...
Bubble Burst 15 Nov 2014, 19:29
+27 -4
Don't you know that any good talent that joins khaitan leaves in a few years? Then khaitan goes back to try to lure new talent with supposedly attractive pay packages (which down the line are not that attractive) along with their PR agency (no other decent firm in India has one)! ... With no real big name ingrown talents of their own ... How long do you think this will last!
ABC 15 Nov 2014, 14:31
+6 -1
True. OVer the last 13 years i have known that for many years Delhi outbilled Mumbai. Delhi partners get paid more than Mumbai (heard it straight from the Horses's moouth)..
merc 16 Nov 2014, 04:17
+3 -2
Merit only applies in bengaluru based law firms
Guest 15 Nov 2014, 12:37
+3 -2
Its very sad to see India's largest law firm squabble like this
Aristotle 15 Nov 2014, 13:58
+11 -1
what drives a brother to fight against a brother, I wonder? the ambanis, the shroffs, all have so much wealth already, but will fight a brother for more wealth.
I wonder again - greed, for a lack of better of word, is good.
The heir and the spare 15 Nov 2014, 15:23
+8 -1
Why did [the mother] favour her elder son? Will big brother (has a nice, devilish ring to it) go the Mukesh Ambani , taking all the premium client, leaving the younger sibling with the left-overs?

I think a complete split would be better for both - and the profession - contrary to what people here have commented that the split would lead to the end of "feudal" culture and what not?

Even seven decades of independence has apparently not reduced one bit, the proclivity of the Indian to lie prostate before the firang. For these pathetic creatures salvation lies in entry of foreign firms.

I hope those firms do come...and these paralegal coolies attain nirvana - like the techno-coolies have in IT.
Guest 15 Nov 2014, 15:24
+0 -4
Where is HSA?
Guest 15 Nov 2014, 16:34
+32 -3
Its troubling that the mother, despite being in the firm for so long, could have done such a ridiculous thing as to will away everything to one son. She should have known it would lead to a split. Cyril is not going to let Shardul own much more of the firm purely because his mother gave her share to Shardul. One would think that Shardul, realising its better to stay together and also, that the mother did a silly thing, would have told his bro that its okay, lets just split it 50:50. But perhaps they are just not that type of people. Sad for them. Its interesting though as to whether a will can trump a contract made by the testator during her lifetime. I think not. Its like the dead cheating the live. Shardul has probably weighed his chances. Having said all this, being a competitor, I find that 80% of all clients who come to us from other firms come to us from Amarchand and for at least 10 years, lack of client satisfaction is highest at Amarchand. Maybe they and the legal profession will be better off with them broken up - less unwieldy as firms and less of a suffocating hold on too much of clientele based mostly on reputation.
Curious Cat 15 Nov 2014, 18:23
+8 -0
People go to new firms from all sorts of other firms with whose service they are dissatisfied (not just from Amarchand). This is not to take away from your comment or your experience. I am sure there are clients who are dissatisfied with Amarchand.

The problem is that law firm quality is individual specific because quality across law firms is patchy. So you either go for a big brand (in the hope that you will get a good lawyer) or you go for a specific individual (and hope and pray that he does some work or at least keeps himself informed about what is going on instead of just dumping it on someone else after attending the first few meetings).

Usually, a bigger brand means quality across the firm is less patchy. Usually. That's the hope.

Unfortunately, there are too many incompetent people in law firms across the country (even at partner level). Sad, but true. So, as the adage goes, you, "pays your money and you takes your chances".
Just wondering 17 Nov 2014, 06:55
+0 -2
Does reputation come out of nowhere? The clients who stay, stay for the work. The clients who leave, leave because they might not be outrightly satisfied and/or pay the high fees. Sole point is, reputations doesnt always remain just because there was.
100 Comments Fan 15 Nov 2014, 16:36
+1 -0
I predict, this will touch comments 300 comments by mid week and 200 by tonight. Common Kian, more updates please. Ideally we want to touch 300 by Sunday night.

Lets hope the Brothers maintain dignity and the preserve the Institution that they built so painstakingly in the last two decades. And I am confident, THEY WILL.
P 15 Nov 2014, 18:43
+7 -0
[quote name="100 Comments Fan"] Common Kian, more updates please. Ideally we want to touch 300 by Sunday night.[/quote]

Dear Stats guy,

Please use COME ON instead of "common".

Thanks,
Common Sense
Outsider 18 Nov 2014, 03:51
+0 -0
Yeah, Kian is anything but common, after all!
Guest 15 Nov 2014, 16:38
+3 -1
I hop everything works out between the two brothers because they deserve it.
equity 15 Nov 2014, 16:48
+0 -0
Guest (it's troubling that the mother..)-excellent comment. It is nice to see such high quality comments on anon threads.
Counsel mania 15 Nov 2014, 18:19
+3 -1
I hear Cyril's line up is salve Manu singhvi Chagla Darius aspi Janak virag ravi Kadam

Sharduls is pc Rohit kapadia navroz

Should be fun

A juicy fight and lots of entertainment for all
Prophet 15 Nov 2014, 18:22
+15 -12
Cyril. Must fight this tooth and nail

The entire legal fraternity is backing him

As is most of corporate India and general public


Good luck Cyril ? Everyone is with you . Fight this injustice from a mean older brother
Mlin 15 Nov 2014, 20:03
+9 -2
Why can't you say injustice from mother. Why blame the brother, he is carrying out mother's wishes.

Or isn't it the situation that Cyril is disrespecting his mother's wishes.

We have properly crossed into personal territory now.
Scooter- 17 Nov 2014, 07:03
+1 -0
Mother's wish could not have simply been to give away her equity to the elder brother. It seems, with all due respect for the deceased, a very callous personal choice it at all. Especially since she, knowing the existence of Framework Agreement, would write a will inconsistent with the same. Cant be that she would not have forseen a dispute, the resultant lack of face for the family and the firm which she along with her husband built over the years. The entire act comes out very immature. Whats surprising is how once can take such decision so as to potentially endanger what you have created1

Whatever it is, this entire scene is going to be a market changer.
posted earlier but anon now 17 Nov 2014, 10:42
+5 -0
Why should the mother treasure the firm over the people. its just a business enterprise, and as Bharati Shroff has shown here, its not and should not be that important to anyone as their legacy (by effectively throwing a spanner into the management committee).

'What did you do in your lifetime'.
'i was a partner at india's largest law firm'.

The pan wala outside peninsula won't know their names.
Gossipmonger 17 Nov 2014, 22:50
+2 -0
Apparently Ekta Kapoor is already in touch with Shroffs for her new TV Soap "Kaun hai Equity ka Hakdaar"!
Purely legal 15 Nov 2014, 18:26
+5 -2
Its an interesting situation. Will a court give effect to a will which will result in breach of contractual obligations of not only the will-maker but also of the primary beneficiary (Shardul in this case). Is Shardul coming before the court with clean hands after having signed the family agreement?

Second line of thought, if the will actually prevails, will cyril's lieutenants actually stay with him if he doesnt have the amarchand name. Where does that leave cyril?
Gift not contract 16 Nov 2014, 03:54
+1 -1
A gift which is to take effect after lapse of time can always be rescinded by the donor before the transfer. Bharti shroff had agreed to gift her shares to her sons equally and changed that with a later testamentary instrument. If seems the devolution of her shares on to the brothers were a part of the framework and not the deed.
anon 16 Nov 2014, 04:48
+1 -1
Clearly, there was no natural love and affection there.

Btw, how are the wives taking it?
Purely legal 16 Nov 2014, 07:38
+1 -0
Thanks. Refreshing to see readers of a legal website still caring about legal niceties in a gossip/malign laced comments page.

To respond, untill consummated, an agreement to gift (presumably that is what you are suggesting the FFA to be) continues to be in the domain of contract law. Ttherefore section 37 of the partnership act may apply to this situation (I may be wrong!).
old furniture 16 Nov 2014, 15:20
+0 -0
promissory estoppel ?
Os 16 Nov 2014, 04:16
+2 -0
Precedent - priyamvada birla case
Bang bang 15 Nov 2014, 18:26
+20 -7
Shardul should retire ASAP

Or the firm should sack him

Even the firms worst enemies could not do as much damage as he has caused to its reputation
Personal wealth 15 Nov 2014, 18:29
+17 -6
I hear the loot other than the firm stuff is about 500 crore . That is what Shardul is really after . Retirement plan ! Ironically the bulk of it is money earned by Cyril ? Wah ! The great Indian robbery
Again You have revealed urslf 15 Nov 2014, 20:03
+2 -6
funny you are commenting on an article about yourself!
posted earlier but Anon now 15 Nov 2014, 20:08
+2 -1
the firm's revenue as seen in certificates to clients (sometimes required in bids for big matters from multilateral banks) were 500cr in year 2005. So you can imagine the amount of money involved now, in the year 2014 with the firm being 3 sizes larger.

the rest of your comment is also very off. But its okay. LI ke liye theek hai.
Delhi spokesperson 15 Nov 2014, 19:47
+20 -2
This is an internal family matter and we do not wish to comment on it BUT we will drag the Firm through this muck by filing a law suit. Slow clap and appreciation of ironic double standards. Classic Dilli.
Seriously? 16 Nov 2014, 06:07
+10 -0
There is some uncertainty about the future of the firm, high possibility of a split, no idea about what will happen to the brand name of the firm. We have also not said anything about this to any of those hundreds whose careers will get affected in some way by this. Other than that its an internal family matter. Yes and Interstellar was a movie about how to grow corn. Sincerely, Corp Corn fan.
Lawyer 2 16 Nov 2014, 03:47
+5 -1
Amarchand 3.0 has now become Amarchand Absolute Zero.

Its incredible that a law firm could air these things publicly. Can this be resolved without a split?
Arnab 16 Nov 2014, 03:50
+10 -0
A source indicates the will casts an unpleasant light on the relations between various family members. [u][b]If the will contents become public, they will probably overshadow the ownership dispute and smear a well reputed family[/b][/u]. WHAT ARE THESE DARK SECRETS? THE NATION WANTS TO KNOW!

Read more at: http://www.moneycontrol.com/news/current-affairs/amarchand-mangaldas-dispute-the-caseshroff-vs-shroff_1229816.html?utm_source=ref_article
anon 16 Nov 2014, 04:03
+0 -4
Kian, why no updates on the foreign law firm issue? I am pasting the latest order.


ITEM NO.24 REGISTRAR COURT. 1 SECTION XII

S U P R E M E C O U R T O F I N D I A
RECORD OF PROCEEDINGS

BEFORE THE REGISTRAR PANKAJ BHANDARI

Petition(s) for Special Leave to Appeal(C)No(s).17150-17154/2012


BAR COUNCIL OF INDIA Petitioner(s)

VERSUS

A.K. BALAJI & ORS. Respondent(s)

Date : 21/08/2014 These petitions were called on for hearing today.

For Petitioner(s)
Mr Aviral Shukla, Adv.
Mr. Ardhendumauli Kumar Prasad ,Adv.

For Respondent(s)
Mr P.V.Saravana Raja, Adv.
Mr. Bijoy Kumar Jain ,Adv.
Ms Neha Agarwal, Adv.
Mr. E. C. Agrawala ,Adv.
Mr. Hari Shankar K ,Adv.
Mr. Nikhil Nayyar ,Adv.
Mr. Rakesh K. Sharma ,Adv.
Ms Tine Abraham, Adv.
Mr. Sakya Singha Chaudhuri ,Adv.
Mr. Subramonium Prasad ,Adv.
Mr Robin R David, Adv.
M/s. Dua Associates ,Adv.
Ms. Meera Mathur ,Adv.

UPON hearing the counsel the Court made the following
O R D E R

Despite undertaking given on 1.7.2014 vakalatnama has
not been filed on behalf of respondent Nos. 22, 29 and 36
though counter affidavit has been filed by the earlier
counsel.
Service is complete on the remaining respondents.

Signature Not Verified
Let the matter be listed before the Hon'ble Judge in
Chambers.
Digitally signed by
Hema Joshi
Date: 2014.08.23
12:51:13 IST
Reason:




(PANKAJ BHANDARI)
Registrar
Seriously? 16 Nov 2014, 06:03
+4 -2
What's up with the copy paste, dude? If you already have the update, why bother Kian? And how is it relevant to this article? I hope you know that accessing the orders on court websites is not that cutting edge. On the other hand at least you didn't copy paste the review of Kill Dill.
Billu Barbar 16 Nov 2014, 18:25
+4 -0
Perhaps he appears in this matter.
G Real Estate.. 16 Nov 2014, 04:29
+16 -1
lol. Now I understand why my cv was not considered even after referred by one brother to another:)
Pious Colaba 16 Nov 2014, 06:29
+18 -3
Unfortunately AMSS is the real loser in this fight : its reputation is now on a steady downward spiral.
Btw, lets not paint Shardul as the evil elder bro : that is nonsense. He is trying to enforce a valid will and that doesn't suit Cyril! (Just fyi, Del ofc earns more revenue than Mum - not sure what the pic is on a consolidated basis tho, i.e., with other offices in the region.)
And yes, I agree with Curious Cat. AMSS (and all the Big 6 law firms) have some very ordinary partners and lawyers who can simply not justify the sky-high fees. For every outstanding lawyer, AMSS (both Del and Mum) has some supremely ordinary ones. Hence, a lot of clients are shifting to smaller firms : the likes of TTA, S&R, UUA, Platinum, Phoenix etc...in the hope of getting individual attention from the partner. Makes sense to me!
Anon 16 Nov 2014, 06:33
+1 -1
Who is Ashwin Maheswari?
TheDuckOfDeath 16 Nov 2014, 07:58
+28 -0
A Muggle hater and practitioner of The Dark Arts.
Mlin 16 Nov 2014, 09:42
+11 -1
an accountant who like all in-house accountants now calls himself CFO.
Outsider 18 Nov 2014, 03:54
+0 -0
Also, a guest lecturer at The Durmstrang Institute.
Anon law student 16 Nov 2014, 07:11
+7 -4
Would this affect recruitment of the current fourth year batch?
Placement Committee 16 Nov 2014, 07:50
+44 -1
Oh. you guys are f****d! No question about that......
reinmaker 16 Nov 2014, 08:57
+0 -1
Now now..
New firm 16 Nov 2014, 11:05
+8 -2
I hope Shardul gets a sense of public opinion from this blog. And takes this matter off the court and has an iota of good sense to resolve it offline . What a foolish thing to do . Would he advise his clients the same thing ? Sheer madness

Also both brothers should get ready for a new firm . New offices? Lots of recruitment all around . The industry will change shape again in a fundamental way
Boo Hoo 16 Nov 2014, 12:05
+8 -1
Umm... public opinion is important or hundreds of crores of rupees... if I were Shardul... I will take my cut and retire
Billu Barbar 16 Nov 2014, 18:27
+3 -1
This is why you are not Shradul.
Billu Barbar 16 Nov 2014, 18:27
+0 -0
@NewFirm: Public opinion? Is this an election?
@Anon law student 16 Nov 2014, 11:29
+9 -16
Notwithstanding this development, if you got in then think again. 7 ATPs from Mumbai region quitting before December itself. 2 TSG members quit this month. Reason is same: frustration coupled with depression.

Sisterly advice: Unless you are aching for money try elsewhere. If you are aching reaaaaaalllly bad try KCo, they pay better.
Curious Cat 16 Nov 2014, 13:03
+1 -1
Causes of frustration and depression?
Hilarious 16 Nov 2014, 15:00
+17 -4
Poor Khaitan dosent get enough recruits on merit it has to use LI comments to get recruits!
Kya 16 Nov 2014, 18:46
+12 -1
Is that a KCO advertisement in the middle of this discussion??!!
Pragmatic 16 Nov 2014, 11:36
+3 -1
Nothing is going to happen. No firm is going to gain from this break up. Even AMSS will not lose out on anything if the brothers split the firm. It will be two separate balance sheets. Thats all. And maybe more offices.
Law-yer 16 Nov 2014, 11:42
+14 -0
Hildul-ji, thanks for the entertainment. Aap bade achhe hain.
Realistic 16 Nov 2014, 12:22
+6 -6
Mr. Pragmatic are you on substance abuse ? Of course the Amss of today has to split. How can it stay as a united firm with those two nuts fighting in court, a media circus and the reputation going to the dogs. They will have no choice . And it's also thebestthing for both offices.

They should. Do it ASAP . Also m p Bharucha will ensure it does even if the brothers do not. . Revenge for him ( and of course utter lack of ethics)
Boo Hoo 16 Nov 2014, 13:30
+9 -6
What ethical rule has MP violated? What law or ethical consideration prevents him from representing Shardul as counsel? He is not a signatory to the partnership deed or the family agreement- he is not a beneficiary of the will- he has never represented Cyril in the same matter. Then where is the lack of ethics? I think it is unethical what Cyril did the last time someone filed a case against him - arm twisted senior counsel from not appearing- whether he is legally right or wrong- Shardul has a right of representation, and MP is right to represent him...

I do not think that MP actually needs to learn ethics from the Shroffs...
Kana Abel 16 Nov 2014, 12:28
+11 -4
Shardul sued Cyril to make him look like a villain. He has actually made him an even bigger hero . Shardul who is your advisor ? Sack them.
The insider 16 Nov 2014, 12:36
+6 -3
Get back to WORK people!!
smartest legal brain 16 Nov 2014, 16:49
+1 -0
The Insider seems to have had a chilling effect, let the comments resume ... surely there's much more left to say
Balanced view please 16 Nov 2014, 14:22
+9 -3
Hi, amidst all this Shardul vilification, I would really urge everyone to consider a few points:
1. It seems SSS went to court only after CSS got the firm MC to divide the equity in half against the will.

2. Post Harry Chawla, Delhi region hadn't nominated his replacement in the MC. That seems to hurt Shardul.

3. The Delhi office actually earns more. So Bombay earning more is not really correct.

Anyway, this has the making of a great legal battle.
Kana Abel 16 Nov 2014, 14:25
+13 -2
Winner number 1 zia Khaitan

Winner number 2 foreign law firms ( their entry is now certain)

Winner number 3 clients as there will be more competition and intense price pressure

Loser no 1 Shardul for being established as the prize fool we already knew he was

Loser no 2 BharatiShroff as she will be remembered very negatively . A career wiped out

Loser no 3 Amss

Loser no4 Cyril for destruction of his dream and as someone who his family hates
Huh 16 Nov 2014, 18:53
+6 -4
Who is zia khaitan? Haha .. Kiddin.. Khaitan walo we know you don't have any work but try and get a life instead of spending all weekend on LI trying to get ur firm some publicity! :)
Scooter- 17 Nov 2014, 07:12
+2 -1
Add the average lawyer to the loser list as well since if competitions goes up and billing rates come down, so will your salary and bonus! have fun hoping for the fall of the mighty!
Realistic 16 Nov 2014, 15:19
+6 -6
Boo hoo you idiot Bharucha was a partner and obviously must be a signatory . Total lack of ethics shameful actually . But then he is known to be strange . Anyway someone or other will examine this .

It's a side show but just shows him in very poor light

Anyway.............
Boo Hoo 17 Nov 2014, 01:46
+6 -2
Realistic- are you even a lawyer? MPB was a partner till 2008- when he left in 2008 the contract must have terminated vis a vis him- see easy to understand- Contract 101- or is it your point that once someone signs an agreement- even if it terminates he continues to be a "signatory"- if thats your understanding then all I can say is- I deeply sympathise

Back to the point, nothing prevents an advocate from litigating a matter where he is not a beneficiary- there is no lack of ethics

Talking of professional ethics- [...]

Those of us who know MPB are appreciative at least of the fact that Justin had to go through the grind and not immediately get established in a cabin-

Mr. Realistic, please spend some time with your law books, you really need to. I wont stoop to the level of calling you an idiot or any such thing- thats self evident...
Boo Hoo 17 Nov 2014, 06:27
+5 -1
Seriously- Kian- calling MPB "strange" and "unethical" and questioning Shardul's intelligence is fine- but identifying blatant nepotism by Cyril in Mumbai has to be censored- sometime I do wonder about this kid's gloves approach you have with AMSS Mumbai
Os 17 Nov 2014, 22:32
+0 -0
I think what he meant is bharucha knows the contract and the politics as he was an insider and, given his history with cyril, he would have an interest in the litigation outcome. We would expect lawyers to be independent of the litigation and not have a stake in it. But again, do we expect a lawyer to be above all that?
popcorn entertainment 16 Nov 2014, 15:48
+2 -0
@kian: wouldn't a live blog about the whole thing be more entertaining than multiple updates to the article? If not now, a live blog for tomorrow's session at 9 where Hildul is going to 'brief' the ppl working at the factory about recent developments?

I'll have my popcorn ready. Oh wait, I think I would be sleeping at that time :p
Working Weekend 16 Nov 2014, 17:12
+8 -1
When was the last time Kian worked through the weekend?
Pikwik 17 Nov 2014, 12:43
+0 -0
Let the man be, bro. Show me where it says everyone involved with the law must work around the clock like it's bonus week.
kianganz 18 Nov 2014, 04:12
+1 -0
I wish I could say you were right. Alas I don't have a life and work most weekends, at least a bit (and sometimes a lot).

I often do long for the days of London BigLaw and it's more humane working hours... ;)
Banana split 16 Nov 2014, 18:30
+9 -3
This whole thing is bananas . Can they please split ASAP and spare the agony . It's not a personal matter. The firm is involved and is joined. Is it not partnership misconduct. They should remove hildul as a partner for having sued the firm. That is exactly what it be. In any other partnership anywhere in the world. Which moron advised hildul ? Can't believe Bharucha is the only person advising him . Not one sensible soul in hilduls camp ??? Such a baaaaad choice
Troll 16 Nov 2014, 20:29
+3 -0
If they check with the IT admin, the bandwidth 'utilised' on this page, LI is goona be blocked!
what is in a name 16 Nov 2014, 23:17
+21 -1
Can someone please tell me why Shardul is called hildul?
100 Comments Fan 17 Nov 2014, 02:08
+5 -0
Guys its Monday morning and we haven't reached the [b]"300" [/b]mark. Please do something about it.
Net neutrality 17 Nov 2014, 02:38
+3 -0
Nobody obviously has any clue about the detailed facts or likely outcome. One thing is for sure though - at this rate of comments, the LI website might just crash soon :)
Mukti 17 Nov 2014, 04:24
+9 -0
Finally an Amss mukt Bharat . Only they could have done it to themselves. Thank you Shardul ! Much appreciated .

We are just revising our business plans

Signed

Zia Haigreve rajiv Rohit Ajay tri legal nishith etc
Eh 17 Nov 2014, 06:24
+1 -1
Who's Rohit?
kuku 17 Nov 2014, 08:25
+3 -0
Maybe he/she meant Rohit Kochhar. If that is true, then yes - who is Rohit to sign this? A nobody in today's legal world. Kochhar is a tier 7 firm
Mantis 17 Nov 2014, 15:41
+1 -0
While you're at it, please also add Tatva Delhi to any reference to Kochhar, since it's the same business model.
posted earlier but Anon now 17 Nov 2014, 05:16
+2 -0
9 am meeting ka kya hua {in delhi amss, where shardul was supposed to address)

he can't swoop on your phones - citrix doesn't take over the system - go ahead and keep spilling
1000 club 17 Nov 2014, 06:03
+8 -0
Let's see who wins the race--1000 associates at amss or 1000 comments on LI?!
Poor Mother 17 Nov 2014, 07:04
+19 -6
Has anyone given a thought as to why Mrs Bharti Shroff did this. She must have been treated really badly for her to take such a decision. She would have known that the brothers would fight given her decision.

It must have been a terrible decision for her. [...] So much for family and values.
daal me kuch kala hai 17 Nov 2014, 08:07
+5 -2
shardul's pr machinery at work!! lage raho munnabahi....
Circuit 17 Nov 2014, 08:22
+3 -3
And how exactly does Shardul (or is it Hildul?) gain from this so-called PR exercise? Are the judges reading these comments to help him win his case??? Absurd comments
Curious Cat 17 Nov 2014, 09:01
+1 -0
It is Hildul.
hmmmm 17 Nov 2014, 08:18
+4 -1
and so shardul decided to play with 600 careers?
Madhurima 17 Nov 2014, 07:10
+5 -1
Over 280 comments ! Cannot pull this off without blue blood and a silver spoon! I'm so jealous!!
Orwell 17 Nov 2014, 07:16
+6 -0
[...]
On a separate note, I believe it was high time that the cycle learnt from the non family driven firms. So unprofession.. and to guise it under all that cog-wheel nonsense! This baniya shop culture in the face of globalisation won't work. If nothing else, learn from the downfall of the Congress! Rather than promoting your own version of RaGa.. anyone notice the uncanny resemblance!
Curious Cat 17 Nov 2014, 09:02
+4 -1
Kian, stop censoring!
Big Bang 17 Nov 2014, 07:26
+13 -0
RIP Family Framework Agreement. Sheldon Cooper will not be happy. I reckon the roommate agreement was the template for the FFA.
PR 17 Nov 2014, 08:19
+2 -1
i remember Mr.Raj kumar's famous dialogue" Chenai seth jiske ghar sheeshe ke hothe hai o dusre ghar pe patthar nahi pekthe" so its waqt waqt ki baath hai - being family issue -let them do their best for their own good. all the best to both the parties. satyame vajeythe
kuku 17 Nov 2014, 08:35
+8 -1
So, we finally see the day where 600 careers can be affected because of a personal family feud. When will we, corporate legal professionals, realize that - enough of working for these family owned banias. NLU students, graduating from the top colleges and being offered employment with these banias, should look only for professionally managed firms. This way, it can show a big 'up-yours' to these family fiefdoms.
Curious Cat 17 Nov 2014, 08:53
+10 -10
What is this professionally managed firm nonsense? Are other "boutique" firms professionally managed? What a joke! With AMSS potentially screwed as a result of this, you will see a lot of pain in the market in the short to mid term with client rates squeezed and lawyer salaries affected. Then you can feel happy working for the boutique Lalas and the foreign Lalas (who will fire you in an economic downturn in the blink of an eye) instead of the mainstream Lalas.

Thank god I'm not a lawyer. Lawyers are such idiots!
say na 17 Nov 2014, 10:45
+0 -0
what do you do if you are not a lawyer
Curious Cat 17 Nov 2014, 12:12
+3 -1
Catch rats.
so you say 18 Nov 2014, 09:17
+1 -1
sachi? Like Pied Piper OR do you catch those rats that are the first to leave a sinking ship?
Confusion 17 Nov 2014, 09:16
+0 -0
Now that everyone is contemplating a split - question is how will the split happen? Bombay office with Cyril n Delhi office with shardul. If office here means office space that's okay. But what about the partnership firm "Amarchand & Mangaldas & Suresh A. Shroff & co." Will this be dissolved and two separate partnership firms will be formed? According to insiders - there are many partnerships deeds (explains how it has more thn 20 equity partners) and if that is true why is there a fight? Are the accounts of all these firms consolidated and thn profit is shared?
Kianocracy 17 Nov 2014, 09:32
+3 -0
What's with the prudish censoring, Kian?
India TV 17 Nov 2014, 09:38
+0 -0
Guys! We have made it. We have crossed 300 mark! Let's cross 400 by tomorrow!
500 Comments fan 17 Nov 2014, 09:42
+2 -0
I have a dream.
Bombay Lawyer 17 Nov 2014, 09:56
+3 -2
If the news is true and he has retained Federal & Rashmikant, he's going to go challenge the will. They are the best Testamentary lawyers right now in Bombay.
correction 17 Nov 2014, 10:47
+3 -1
best lawyers in litigation. Please check the aforementioned comments.
amss guy 17 Nov 2014, 10:03
+5 -1
Kim K. failed to break the internet. But, LI comments on this article will.
BomHC Insider 17 Nov 2014, 10:20
+0 -0
Matter listed before Dhanuka, J. at serial no.6 tomorrow mornin (18 November, 2014)
Bombay Lawyer 17 Nov 2014, 10:35
+0 -0
The Notice of Motion is listed for "Ad - Interim" relief before the Hon'ble Dhanuka J tomorrow at S.No.6. I wonder who they will instruct to argue the matter. Hmm. My guess is that it will be either Mr. Dhonde or Mr. Dwarakadas . Lets see.
kianganz 17 Nov 2014, 10:52
+3 -0
Word on the street is Shardul Shroff is briefing Rohit Kapadia, and Cyril Shroff going with Janank Dwarkadas and others, but don't fully know yet...
DBS 17 Nov 2014, 11:18
+0 -0
Everyone will know by noon tomorrow!! Not sure what ad-interim, but matter may get adjourned!!
Bombay Lawyer 17 Nov 2014, 11:50
+0 -0
Word on the street. Literally right outside the BHC. Federal & Rashmikant are instructing Mr.Dwarakadas. Not sure who Barucha & Partners are instructing.
Guest 17 Nov 2014, 11:59
+0 -0
Advantage Cyril then I guess.
Job Aspirant 17 Nov 2014, 10:45
+0 -2
As per this article AMSS offered a package of 15 lakhs to Kapil Duggal of NLIU. If false, I feel TOI is overtaking Hindustan Times.
http://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/bhopal/bhopal-kapil-steals-show-with-7-medals/article1-1286683.aspx
Idea 17 Nov 2014, 11:11
+0 -0
This might be a good time for Shardul to pick up the phone and take a cue from the then partners and associates at J.B. Dadachanji & Co. on what is to follow...
Bombay Lawyer 17 Nov 2014, 11:50
+1 -0
I'll post once I see what happens in Cr.6 tomorrow.
Bombay Lawyer 17 Nov 2014, 12:07
+26 -1
Shardul had to approach the HC to probate the will. The family owns immovable property within the original side of the Bombay High Court so he being the executor had to approach the High Court for a probate. Its mandatory in these cases. That explains the testamentary petition. Since everything flows from the probate of the will, a suit has to be filed because the managing committee of the partnership split its share in a manner not consistent with the will. Unfortunately Shardul as the Late Mrs. Shroff's executor has the duty to make that challenge so that the will is executed properly.

The Ad-interim is to probably prevent Cyril from disposing of property till the suit is adjudicated. That's tomorrow. The real thing to watch is the probating of the will. Cyril needs to protest the will if he is to get his share. Other issues will arise is under Family Law, was the property held by the Late Mrs. Shroff actually hers to will away or was it common property. Another key element would be the Family Agreement, if the family agreement provided for a manner of partitioning shares, was her will even valid? As in were the shares free from encumbrances at the point they were willed to the Mr. Shardul Shroff. Interesting questions of law in this. Very interesting questions.

More importantly, tomorrow if C.Shroff appears before the HC and undertakes that the suit property won't be disposed off until the matter is settled or adjudicated upon, I'd have to look far to find a judge why would not take C.Shroff at his word and issue the injunction notwithstanding.
Good Job 17 Nov 2014, 13:05
+0 -0
Nice Analysis. Expecting a detailed post from you tomorrow.
Mantis 17 Nov 2014, 15:26
+0 -0
CSS would not fight an injunction against disposal other than, if at all, for posturing. I'm sure the endgame is better known to both CSS and SSS than us. Call it trolling or whatever, looks like CSS would get to finally keep the firm, while SSS would indeed get the premium for conceding that.
Delhi Lawyer 18 Nov 2014, 01:11
+1 -1
1. I think there would be an undertaking by both sides and no injunction would in effect be granted .
2. Status quo will be maintained and in the process there would be two firms in the very near future .
There is enough and more for both sides . Matter being in Bombay will take for ever to decide .
Bombay Lawyer 18 Nov 2014, 03:46
+0 -0
Not if both parties want to expedite it and don't ask for too much time for filing WS etc. Matter should take a year and a half in Bombay if everyone cooperates towards a speedy disposal.
Tareekh 17 Nov 2014, 17:48
+0 -0
Tomorrow matter will get adjourned. Yawn!

But will bea fun spectacle
Insider 17 Nov 2014, 19:26
+4 -0
So much for the so called Amarchand family. While the Kartas are fighting among themselves the others are kept in complete dark. Poor associates (including the glorified associates - read Partners) have no clue where the firm is heading to and what is in store for them. They are no better thn the reset of the world. Sad!
Troll 17 Nov 2014, 21:36
+1 -9
NLU Delhi is better than NLU Jodhpur.
Observer 18 Nov 2014, 01:21
+3 -0
Hello insider number 134 . Firm is certainly headed for a split. No question about that . It is now impossible to believe otherwise. Faster the better for all concerned. After the current turbulence things will be normal. Because all things must pass. There will be two firms with Shardul having a Mumbai office and vice versa. . Both will do well. Word is that both brothers have informally agreed to split from January 1 .
tooting horn 18 Nov 2014, 03:57
+0 -0
I wish the legal battle was taking place in the Delhi High Court. We here shall miss all the fun :(
Tongueincheek 18 Nov 2014, 05:09
+4 -1
This all follows from the last management committee meeting of Amarchand, where it was decided that they must have the most number of comments on a LI article. Let us show the world and the guys at PXV, RDA, etc. how it is done, the big daddies said. And lo, here it is....350 and counting!
anynomus 18 Nov 2014, 05:53
+4 -0
Interestingly that this fight has not figured in The Lawyer. kian you not contributing articles anymore. AmSS office expansion is news for the Lawyer but not this. That's what's called media relationship. kudos to you kian.
Triviaman 18 Nov 2014, 06:35
+0 -0
Kian, what's the record for the most number of comments on an article on LI?
kianganz 18 Nov 2014, 06:36
+4 -0
This one... ;)
WTF 18 Nov 2014, 10:33
+0 -0
Damp squib...had the makings of a real cracker of a street fight...sad, very sad.
Troll 18 Nov 2014, 11:39
+0 -0
Who owns the equity in AoR firm M/S SURESH A. SHROFF & Co?
Law-yer 18 Nov 2014, 16:19
+0 -0
Try to get this one to 1000 and encourage all to keep fighting, some of us much maligned poor lit lawyers should also earn sometimes. ;)