This is simply crazy! Won't be surprised if more from NDA exit to join Anagram!

Reminds me of some poetic words written by Mirza Ghalib:
'Bade be-aabaru ho kar tere kuche se hum nikale..'

Certainly doesn’t look like a voluntary exit. Jiska koi nai uska Start up hota hain!

Great news for this firm business wise but hope that all the associates who sign up for this knoww what they are getting into. Shuva Mandal is a great lawyer but have heard some pretty horrible stories of how he treats his juniors and that dozens of people have left jobs because of him.

As always, he didn't have much of a team left with him.
Not everyone is like Ashwath whose (almost) entire team moved along with him. [... ]

Most observations are superficial. Before any youngster takes steps to join him, or for that matter any other law firm, they should do a diligence on the people first. If they don’t then God help them.

When tata loses at NCLAT - it is His Loss

When Tata wins at SC - it is salve

Make up your mind.

It is unfortunate that in all this so many junior lawyers who worked tirelessly day and night are forgotten. The credit should go to the entire team and it’s captain the TATA GC.

What has changed since the time you disclosed Rajesh, Simone and Pratibha's exit? This rumor was out even at that time, going to press w/o details and comments - could have done two months back na bro.

The likes of Anagram and AZB are still more respectable to work in. Consider the current menu card:

CAM - join if you think “law” is a “lady” and the practice of law is service to a family.

SAM - join if you have JSA nostalgia.

KCO - good place for first year’s to join as partners. Yes they are offering that as well these days.

Trilegal: as the name suggests they are the real try(ers). If you do not get equity anywhere this is your place.

Only one horrible Hindi song describes the moment — j(z)ia jale..

kian can you get Big mumma’s comment on this story?

Bunch of really hard working and driven guys at Anagram.

All the best to the team.

He is more like Arnab. 'I am the best".

Good to see the announcement of something we have been hearing about for the past 3 years. When he joined Tata i said to myself if he plays his cards right he could one day become its CEO. Me thinks he &#@*!ed up. Wishing him success in his new venture. We need more choices and any viable alternative that challenges status quo is welcome. Hope he plays his cards well this time. There can be no law firm without loyal associates. Leaders will do well if they remember that. less of the hubris and more of the leading by example.

Anagram will need a big office considering what is about to unfold soon in the legal market.

Anyone knows why they have not made an announcement till now unlike other firms who announce senior associate promotions and pseudo partnership promotions!

Good move
:
:
:
for Tatas.

CJ House (of Jaguar showroom fame) is good for Harvey Spectres
The Bombay House (of Palkhivala fame) needs ppl with more depth.

Ram milaye jodi....:)

Whoa this feed is on a roll.

I reckon the only other time LI threads gained traction when Ashwath Rau made a move to AZB & Partners from SAM. While a Partner move within Tier I obviously grabs press and makes a good read, this seems to be the move of the decade as the GC move with one of the largest conglomerates was a recipe to be at the helm of affairs(read: CEO) as someone had mentioned in the above threads.

It will be interesting to see if any of the Tier I's now again try to get him back as his reputation as a Rainmaker precedes him. Any news of a formal press release from Tata Sons as he is a Director in some Tata companies which will mandate a disclosure to SEBI.

have to give it to some of the comments above(unless i am deciphering it wrong) that talent without zilch leadership skills will not take you to places.

Haven’t there been many startups emerging from AZB? Veritas, JMP etc So ppl get so dissatisfied with the place that they feel starting from scratch is better than being chased for time sheets. Thoda freedom doh, let grown ups be. Even kids don’t get disciplined like this.

Short tempered and impatient people are not respected by the top management in Tatas. They will be tolerated to a certain extent but then politely (or otherwise) shown the door especially if they are holding senior positions - irrespective of their technical brilliance. This is why this group is so well respected from a culture and values standpoint.

I worked in his team at azb and later at a law firm who got some work from him. He was articulate and clever but definitely not a team leader or even a particularly brainy person. Zia did give him a lot of her top clients and he did handle them well enough but only under her umbrella. Knowing the ethos of the Tata group this was definitely a bad fit for both and for those who know him it's no surprise he's moving on.

The harsh truth is that he was M&A lawyer and not a Tata Group GC material. Both require fundamentally different qualities. This was quite evident to Bombay House insiders from Day 1. Fell out too soon. Gradually eased out. Market dynamics have significantly altered in the last few years post AMSS split and aggressive KCO. M&A/ PE market heavily over-lawyered. Economy is devastated by Pandemic. Not sure timing is right for Anagram.

Correction- Had Shuva not left AZB , he would have succeeded Zia there and Ashwath would have remained at CAM. Reeba also would not have been where she is and the same applies for Nivedita Rao. Ashwath would have been the head of corporate at CAM on par with LV.

The man was never a team player. Lacked [...] which are crucial for the GC role. Was side lined even in Tata-Mistry battle in the SC. His team had left within one year. It is most unlikely that he will change. Anagram has a bleak future. I will be surprised if it exists after 2 years.

Shuva was clearly a good lawyer but his style of working was simply not sustainable. His [...] intemperate remarks were par for the course at a big law firm like AZB or SAM where partners get away with atrocious behaviour but had no place in an old-school business like Tata. Most of the senior management of Tata are chosen specifically for their attitude and personal skills, Shuva was probably given some rope early on but ran out of it later. A leopard never changes its spots as they say. As to future who knows what lies ahead, but ironically Shuva will have to become a much nicer person to succeed in running his own firm since he wont have the cash cow of Zia or the umbrella of Tata to shelter him.

One thing is certain. If he wants this firm to survive, it has to have a good culture. He cannot run the firm like he ran his teams in the past. Things have changed, there are a lot of firms in the industry that do good work and have polite people. If he continues being oblivious on the human side of things, his ship will sink sooner than he can imagine. Today's generation has no patience for unwarranted toxicity and it's easy to find jobs anywhere if you have one year PQE even. They won't hesitate to leave for a better cultured firm. Shuva will either change on his own or the circumstances will compel him to change. Hope it's the former, for the sake of people who join him.

Being a successful lawyer is much more than simply getting a partner tag and simply running a few transactions.

Shuva by any stretch was successful at AZB. But he managed barely two years at SAM at a prestigious designation of National M&A Head and then lasted a mere 3.5 years at the Tata Group (rumours of his departure were in the air for the last year or so, he was likely preparing to leave sooner but covid came in the way).

This says a lot about his skills as a leader. It's obvious that his success at AZB was due to some mollycoddling by Zia, that was no secret. Unfortunately his shortcomings were/are too large to get him any where meaningful outside of that comfort zone. Overall he's a poor leader no matter how well he negotiates a shareholder contract and this Anagram startup is surely the end of the road for him. I'd be surprised if his abrasive personality permits Anagram to even overtake Rajaram Legal.

I've seen so many comments here on how Shuva Mandal has a temperament issue, is not a good leader, etc. Though I have not worked with him, the overwhelming number of comments reiterating this, makes it pretty clear that all of what is being said about his agressive nature and style of working is true.

Now, I'm not joining Anagram any time soon, not really bothered about his style of working. But some observations which are relevant to all need to be made.

1. Given he made a name for himself at AZB and also worked at SAM for some time, it speaks a lot about these firms and other law firms in general. It is clear that these law firms don't really care about how bad a person may be with his juniors, as long as that person is a big name and can make them money. Now, fundamentally there is no issue, a Firm's management can do as it pleases and can run the business however it wants and profitability may be all that matters. But if that's the case, please stop paying lip service to stuff like mental health and other such matters. As a bare minimum, be honest. If that's not possible, at the very least, do not put on a fake show like you care.

2. Shuva Mandal would have started his career as an associate and progressed through different levels before he became a big shot partner. During this period, he would have had juniors. Pretty safe to assume that his bad temperament would not have developed over a day and that his juniors (even when he was not a partner) would have had to face his temper issues even then. And that these juniors would have flagged the issues to Shuva's superiors at the firm. What is evident is that none of his actions or his behaviour was condemned by any of his superiors, which is why he continued like he did.
Bear in mind this is not a Shuva specific issue. I have worked for a long time in a team where the junior partner is, by all accounts, a man who has temperament issues, bad working habits, negative attitude and untrustworthy. But the senior equity partner refuses to condemn this junior partner, despite several people having quit their jobs thanks to the junior partner and having reported concerns about the junior partner's behaviour. Moral of the story, even if the senior person may himself be a nice person, if he refuses the condemn the horrible behaviour of the junior person, the senior is equally to blame. Again, the senior partner is free to make money for the firm in any manner. But do not maintain the fake pretence that you care about every junior in the team.

Bottomline : (1) If you want peace of mind and better mental health, avoid horrible bosses, irrespective of how well known they may be in legal circles. (2) Law firms and partners can only pay lip service to mental health and cannot walk the talk.

Super team at Anagram. Hear some more big guys are joining soon.

There is just one word which describes a person who engages in the kind of behaviour being described in the comments - 'bully'. I'm sorry if this offends anybody, but it is an accurate word of the English language which summarises such characteristics. Kian please do not censor this - I have not called anyone names, just labelled the behaviour which is described in the comments. Let's call a spade a spade.

Ab bas Karo yaar..bachhe ki jaan loge kya?

One unsolicited piece of advice: ‘risk taker’ ‘start up’ etc are all fine..but it also shows confused state of mind. Age is still on his side but now he should sick to this AnaGram or else his status will become that of ‘Aaya Ram...Gaya Ram.’

It doesn’t matter a thing to the world of law and serious lawyers though.

Ps: please follow “Covid appropriate behaviour”

If as this report suggests, this gentleman was involved in setting up a law firm (interviewing partners et al) while still being in employment with the Tatas, seems like a conflict which most corporates would never allow. Unless of course these are unfounded rumours or he took a specific no objection from his employer with the understanding that he would eventually go. Best of luck to him in his future endeavours.

Let’s do a quick #iwasbullied check to see if we have people who were personally affected by his behaviour or is this all just conjecture?

Can anybody list out which branch(es) of law he is really great or stellar at? Not to take away from whatever he has done but please let us not go over the top - either in criticism or praise.

Kian, perhaps you should go beyond reporting this ‘massive’ move and do some research or a survey or whatever, and come out with a TRUTH vs. HYPE story. On this very LI platform ppl had commented that how BIG was this GC role at Tatas and how BIG an accomplishment was it for SM to get it at such a young age. Indeed it was. Why SM did not make it big? Why he couldn’t become the Palkihivala of Bombay House? Don’t dismiss it by saying that was a different era. Don’t also try to find an alibi in the (misplaced) notion that if one is in-house he or she cant be a great lawyer.

The theory that he was there for Tata-Mistry and now that it’s over he is going to do better things, appears to be bu@l sh#it . He didn’t need to be in GC role to do this case. If he did get into this role because of or only for the case then it shows immaturity and lack of clarity on what one wants to do. That, for a man of his age & experience, is not a desirable thing. Good luck for Anagram or whatever it is. But introspection is in order.

Please dont pounce on me..i am one of you. But do we really feel it matters to a Ratan Tata or N Chandrasekaran or Mukesh Ambani which lawyer is working on their ‘deals’? Those deals will happen regardless. Unless the ‘law’ aspect of PE deals has been evolving like Art 14 jurisprudence and we contribute to that, what exactly we do to call ourselves a stellar or great lawyer?

Whether the move is voluntary or involuntary is not the issue. What’s clear is that it doesn’t matter to Tatas. Why is it that? Do they not value “great’ or ‘stellar’ lawyers if Shuva was one? or is it that he was not. It’s not about him. The truth is that none of us are, or even getting there. Most of us are operating at a superficial level. We have somehow got more interested in the business of law and that’s why being a ‘money spinner’ is a quality that matters to us. But perhaps that’s not a quality that would impress Tatas or others like them. They have many in their business teams who will spin the money. May be they look for something else in lawyers to command their respect.

How many of us are even closer to being in a position even 10-15 yrs from now where Tatas or Ambanis will send their private jets to fetch us for a consultation or a Ratan Tata or a Mukesh Ambani would personally come to our office to seek advice, as they would do for a Harish Salve or a Darius Khambata?

Did SM, who supposedly “delivered” the victory in Tata-Mistry case for Tatas, really go into the depth of how the jurisprudence of oppression & mismanagement remedy has evolved? I doubt he did. Can he do a serious piece of drafting or legal writing? Does he have the skills of articulation and persuasion to stand up in a court and hold the ground even for 5 minutes? What other areas other than PE deals and M&A on which he can speak with depth and influence or inspire an audience? Will his clients consult him or rely on him for the finer aspects of the law? Again, it’s not about him. It applies to many of us.

It is not about litigation vs transaction lawyering ..it is also not about in house vs. private practice. It is about being truly a great lawyer. If SM was truly stellar and wanted to do private practice may be tatas would have allowed him to do that and given him a senior board position. Palkhivala was a practitioner (perhaps the greatest lawyer ever) but also on the board of tata sons and chairman of several tata companies. So being with Tatas did not come in the way of being a great lawyer.

We may not want to accept it but truth is that most of us are interested in making a career and that’s why we get excited about becoming Partners, or even PA, SA, PAD, etc (God, these sound like transaction documents:-) ) We find alibis like in-house is not that great or we are working on big deals, or now this hype abt setting up a start up. (By the way the legal profession is perhaps the oldest space for startups. All those who are working hard in the litigation space with small set up are in a way startups. So it’s not a new thing).

We will live comfortable lives, work on big deals, have office in the most fancy building and bask in being a ‘money spinner’ but we will not be able to earn a place in the world of law for being a “great” lawyer. This is the HYPE and TRUTH of it — whether we like it or not.

I see from some comments on this thread the fascination for being in the league of Harvey Spectre. I shudder to think if many of us are learning our law by watching Suits and not by reading Seervai.

SM should introspect. All of us should.

will this thread/article/news item cross 200 comments?

Ignoring the personalities for a more objective debate, “bullying” has certainly become the major problem with the most large law firms. It is a central issue but most managing partners are turning a blind eye as most bullies are high billing partners. Interpersonal skills are never taught in the law schools. Every senior believes that he or she has a fundamental right to bully his or her junior and the chain goes tight up to equity partner level. Most law firms are facing a very high attrition at Associates level as no one is now willing to take inhuman treatment meted out. But unless this problem is addressed, law firm attritions are here to stay. If profit is the only benchmark for evaluating performance at the end of the year and such softer issues are ignored, then the current law firm model is heading for a disaster. There is srrong evidence of serious mental health issues facinh most major law firms. Hope the Managing Partners wake up.

While a legend like Shuva Mandal doesn’t need any defending (and at the risk of being heavily trolled myself), it was too jarring to see so much hate in the comments to not say anything. Especially as someone who learned so much from working with Shuva. I for one felt he was a great leader. Never tried to impress clients with aggressive timelines at the associate’s cost. He also encouraged associates to front discussions with clients and lead negotiations for their personal growth (versus wanting to be debriefed and lead everything himself).

And for the comments claiming that Zia mollycoddled Shuva to fame – I don’t even know where to start with that one. Mollycoddle just doesn’t fit in the same sentence with these two formidable personalities.

This is not to belittle anyone’s negative experience. This is just to share that my experience was positive and the potential for growth from working with Shuva is infinite. And no, I wasn’t the only freak who felt that way :)

If Big Law /‘law firm’ culture is too toxic, please do start out on your own. Once you’ve mastered winning clients while keeping your team happy, motivated and challenged (not to forget well compensated!), do let us all know what the magic formula is so we can bring out much needed change. It’s a learning curve and so much easier said than done.

Having worked with Rajesh and Simone during my time at NDA + Shuva while at AZB, it is beyond fantastic to see them join forces. Clearly they’ve taken the legal world by storm before they’ve even started. Congratulations!