Sleep every night for eight hours. If I work late, I wake up late. Boss doesn't have the balls to bring it up. It's a basic human right. Rok sako toh rok lo.
Don’t get bothered by this question. Whichever law firm you work for (be it Latham, White & Case or even AZB) you get appropriate time for sleep (ranging from 6-8 hours every day). At the end its your choice, you work or you don’t.
For me, more than sleep, the constant state of urgency and panic is the issue. Even less sleep is fine if it’s free of stress from the pending work and deadlines
To be honest, it depends on how much you are ready to be a doormat. Post COVID, asking people to sacrifice on their health is tantamount to mental harassment at workplace. Nobody is going fire you if you say no to doing work after having worked for 12 hours. Or if you simply state that you sleep from 12 AM to 7 AM.
But once you let them break that, appear as someone who can be pliable, who can be a doormat, who cannot draw boundaries, they'll run all over you and start calling you at 3 AM in the night. If your SA/PA calls you post 12 AM without your consent, make it known that you consider it a violation of your personal boundaries. If they say something along "you work in a law, you are expected to.." just report them to the HR and call them out publicly to make it known it's not acceptable.
People may act grumpy after that, but nobody will fire you. The desirability of a law firm job is at an all time low. HRs are random messaging people on LinkedIN. Nobody wants to work in toxic work environments after realising how short and vulnerable their lives are post this pandemic.
Another frustrated Associate who think he is as worth as a partner. "Desirability of a law firm job is at an all time low"?
We are receiving record breaking amounts of application every quarter. Even college RCC's pester us every week. We can't even skim through good CV's. Hundreds of laterals are also keen to get in the law firm boat.
Even 10 years back comments on LI were like this. All law firms won't have ao's and what not.
You HRs are the biggest problem. I don't even know what makes you qualified to hire lawyers or law students for internships. And please learn to respond faster to emails and draft them properly.
Because you are another associate who is soon to be replaced. Instead of getting a sleep or working, you scrolling on this whining threads which doesn't help.
Agree.Even before pandemic,there were many exhausted from the toxic law firm culture leaving in less than 2-3 years but with the pandemic,law students and laterals are looking at options apart from law firms hit by the realization that life really could be short and no point working maddening hours of a job sacrificing whatever life you have.Never thought a day would when money cannot be number one priority but it has indeed arrived.The pandemic has been an eye opener for many.Better late than sorry in making smart decisions.
Hi my dudes - I think the question asked by the OP dude should be rephrased to "How many hours a day do you work". Because that has a direct impact on how much time of the 24 hours are left for you to eat food, say hi to partner/ spouse and sleep. I'll give you my example as i don't waste my time looking at anyone else, or the general rule that is followed in in other teams.
1. During covid, (at least 4 days in a week) my seniors start messaging me by the time they have had their breakfast or before they do, asking that i get some research/ email/ deliverable done/ cleared/ seduced.
2. Average of 3 to 4 zoom calls a day, with constant phone calls and watsapp messages through the day, which by default increases the amount of time i would otherwise need to finish something. So if i need to make a standard DD requisition list that would take me 2 hours, i spend 3 hours.
3. on average i submit stuff, send emails and close things by 8. but 3 times a week, i have to send emails and review work after 8 depending on how urgent my otherwise incompetent senior thinks things are. or if the partner drops a message on the group with regards to an artificial urgency to get things done. im done by 10:30.
The above does not apply for filing weeks/ weekends, during which work is 20 hours a day.
So on a good normal day, i expect to sleep 6 - 7 hours. I would like to get in 8 hours but because i need the money, and am scared of losing my job or pissing off a senior who i know is not worth the dime he/ she is paid, i get panic attacks from 7 AM to check email and phone to make sure i haven't missed a call, email or message.
Dont be like me dudes. Switch off your work phone post 8 PM and only turn it on only post 9 AM in the morning. There is literally a 8 percent chance that they will fire you. Unless you work in capital markets like me. Enough monkeys out there to replace me and my entire team.
“i get panic attacks from 7 AM to check email and phone to make sure i haven't missed a call, email or message.” Can relate. Also, I hate being required to be available on call 24/7.
Hi my dude - I work for a few hours here and there during weekends ! but a lot more on filing weekends.
That being said...during covid, i have noticed that clients/ bankers leave us a lot of work on Friday which they then expect to receive by monday. So........
"Money is a bitch that never sleeps."
- Gordon Gekko
But once you let them break that, appear as someone who can be pliable, who can be a doormat, who cannot draw boundaries, they'll run all over you and start calling you at 3 AM in the night. If your SA/PA calls you post 12 AM without your consent, make it known that you consider it a violation of your personal boundaries. If they say something along "you work in a law, you are expected to.." just report them to the HR and call them out publicly to make it known it's not acceptable.
People may act grumpy after that, but nobody will fire you. The desirability of a law firm job is at an all time low. HRs are random messaging people on LinkedIN. Nobody wants to work in toxic work environments after realising how short and vulnerable their lives are post this pandemic.
Another frustrated Associate who think he is as worth as a partner. "Desirability of a law firm job is at an all time low"?
We are receiving record breaking amounts of application every quarter. Even college RCC's pester us every week. We can't even skim through good CV's. Hundreds of laterals are also keen to get in the law firm boat.
Even 10 years back comments on LI were like this. All law firms won't have ao's and what not.
1. During covid, (at least 4 days in a week) my seniors start messaging me by the time they have had their breakfast or before they do, asking that i get some research/ email/ deliverable done/ cleared/ seduced.
2. Average of 3 to 4 zoom calls a day, with constant phone calls and watsapp messages through the day, which by default increases the amount of time i would otherwise need to finish something. So if i need to make a standard DD requisition list that would take me 2 hours, i spend 3 hours.
3. on average i submit stuff, send emails and close things by 8. but 3 times a week, i have to send emails and review work after 8 depending on how urgent my otherwise incompetent senior thinks things are. or if the partner drops a message on the group with regards to an artificial urgency to get things done. im done by 10:30.
The above does not apply for filing weeks/ weekends, during which work is 20 hours a day.
So on a good normal day, i expect to sleep 6 - 7 hours. I would like to get in 8 hours but because i need the money, and am scared of losing my job or pissing off a senior who i know is not worth the dime he/ she is paid, i get panic attacks from 7 AM to check email and phone to make sure i haven't missed a call, email or message.
Dont be like me dudes. Switch off your work phone post 8 PM and only turn it on only post 9 AM in the morning. There is literally a 8 percent chance that they will fire you. Unless you work in capital markets like me. Enough monkeys out there to replace me and my entire team.
Thank you for detailed answer!!
That being said...during covid, i have noticed that clients/ bankers leave us a lot of work on Friday which they then expect to receive by monday. So........