Terrorists absolutely shout allah hu Akbar when they kill innocent people. As long as you feel no one should shout that again just like JSR we are in agreement. I don’t like any religion either.
But if you’re gonna contextualise “ why in this one instance were Muslims
shouting a religious slogan ? Was it to
Intimidate ?” You have to contextualise it for the JSR folks also - which instance is Dalwai speaking of ? How do we know it was to intimidate ?
If all you learnt from law school was to cling to appeals from authority - you’ve been quite poorly served. I think the actions of Hamas on oct 7 were clearly the actions of a terrorist. If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck - might be a duck. I disagree with you on facts about israels war - I’m unsure we have all the reporting in on how this war is being fought. There is a lot of propaganda from both sides and I refuse to take my news from Instagram. In any case israel is a recognised state for 70 something years now and if they have committed war crimes they should be held accountable. The facts might show that israel has fought this war as well as they can - that they have avoided civilian casualties and focused on returning hostages and destroying Hamas in which case they shouldn’t get condemnation.
That is called holocaust reversal and it’s rooted in anti semitism. On October 6 there was a cease fire in Gaza and West Bank. Israeli parliament and Supreme Court have Arab Muslims and Christian members, Nazis killed and persecuted gay people and Israel is the only middle eastern state where those people are safe and have rights.
Israel has enough fire power to obliterate Gaza today. But in the last few decades Palestinian population has grown instead of declined.
It sure seems to me that it israel was a bigoted genocidal state like nazi Germany - they should be better at the bigotry or the genocide no ?
How many Jews peacefully live in Gaza ? How many Christians? Can gay people become leaders of Hamas ? Can women ?
The stated goal of israel in its founding documents is a peaceful prosperous state - the stated goal of Hamas is to kill the Jews. Why is Israel nazis again?
No they learned that pretty probably from goebelles . There were nazis. And as much as it may complicate your relationship to a black and white oppressor/oppressed narrative - they were targeting and killing Jews many of whom reside in Israel.
If folks shout that in front of a Hindu with the sole intention of marginalising them or intimidating them, especially if the latter is in the middle of religious activity, then yes, it should be stopped or criticized at the very least. You can't bait me that way, what I find abhorrent applies to all the religions.
With regard to October 7, there's a difference between heinous acts and an organisation being acknowledged under domestic law as a terrorist organisation. As a lawyer, you're supposed to be able to identify that difference. I find Hamas' actions to be reprehensible and strongly condemn it. I feel the same way about Israel's retaliation too including all the murdering of innocent civilians and children. If you want to pressurize the Indian government to include Hamas in the list of organisations that we recognise as terrorists, I am all in support. Till then, it is not one at least under Indian law. Otherwise, people would have been arrested for inviting their representatives to air their opinions in programmes.
So folks shouting allah hu akbar should also stop? because terrorists use it all the time no?
Do you think oct 7 was a terrorist act? or do you think the rape of women and murder of babies is legitimate resistance? we dont need to appeal to authority when we can simply look at actions to decide no?
Agree with most of what you said, subject to pointing out that Hamas is not recognised as a terrorist organisation yet by India and that JSR has been politically and socially coloured to almost drown its religious and spiritual connotations and that not only radical elements but a not so inconsiderable size of the population use it currently to score political or worse, communal points.
I have a message for Professor Sameena Dalwai, if she's reading:
1. A university is not meant to be a space for political indoctrination.
2. No professor should shut down voices contrary to theirs.
3. Hamas is a terrorist organisation and the Israel-Palestine issue is not as black and white as the left is making it out to be.
4. Jai Shri Ram is an age-old, religious slogan. The slogan itself cannot become offensive because radical elements use it. By that logic, the same can be said of slogans from Islam and Sikhism.
5. The word "ch***ya" may be a synonym for "fool", but it is a vulgar synonym, similar to saying
"dumbf**k" instead of "fool". Such words should never be used by professors against student.
6. Showing dating profiles of students, or outing students with dating profiles, is never acceptable and a gross violation of privacy and teaching ethics.
Please see this video by Newslaundry. It cites a Hindi dictionary where it clearly says that chutiya means fool, with usage dating back to 1907. This usage continues today. The video also shows right-wing hero Yogi Adityanath using the word in this sense.
Thus, Prof Dalwai's only offence is sticking to the dictionary meaning of the word (also used by Yogi-ji) and not imagining that right-wing students would have a dirty mind where they equate chutiya to mean a vulgar expression for vagina (despite their hero using it in the dictionary sense).
Can someone answer this: Why did she have to open Bumble to explain the role of caste and looks in selecting partners? Why not just show any newspaper matrimonial section which says fair-skinned Brahmin boy/girl wanted?
Misunderstood. How little must you think of the opposition to assume they just went “ hurr durr hate women” when really students might have been uncomfortable opening and commenting on the dating profiles of their friends and fellow students ? I agree with Dalwai that caste and gender play a role in mate selection - wouldn’t showing studies on low rates of intermarriage / showing the matrimonial section of any news paper have done the same job? Wouldn’t assigning a reflective short answer that asked students to think about their own choices do the job ? And even if caste and gender affect mating choices - what exactly are we supposed to do about it ? Should we all collectively guilt ourselves into dating people we don’t feel desirable ? Should we constantly talk about our preferences as if they were prejudices so we’d be seen as morally superior ? The left starts with a good idea and does no follow through. Answer the question - so what ?
When you’re trying to be provocative - should you be surprised that you’ve provoked people ? That one goes for Hamas and Dalwai tbh:
Having said that - I don’t think she should lose her job over the bumble affair. It’s a badly thought out lesson plan but it’s not worthy of firing. She should lose her job for the chutiya stuff. That’s inexcusable.
It’s a curious kind of leftist activism that wants to hide its face and demand that people ask them consent to film speeches given in public forum. It’s stupid to expect speeches given in any public forum to be private or to not be recorded in this day and age. And if you believe what you say - you shouldn’t have trouble with people recording you.
If you feel such shame at what you’re saying that you have to hide your face - consider why that might be. If you want to hide your face because you know many people disagree - consider for a moment that you might not be completely right all the time.
Having said that - right wing students can’t cry about cancel culture if they do the same thing. And recording and sending stuff to op India is cowardly when you could actually use your brains to challenge the argument in the room. You cannot be so convinced of your righteousness/ so drunk on your power that you forget that you come to university to learn and expose yourself to people who might not think like you. The right is not solely guilty of this - but Jgls students take it to extremes.
Left wing students in Jindal need to ask themselves what their priorities are. Are they really willing to risk their credibility on half baked ideas about Palestine / Israel gained from insta reels ? Or defending a professor who has clearly done some objectionable stuff in the classroom ? Or would their time be better spent working on winnable local fights ? Next election is less than a year away- they can do voter registration work in Haryana , go door to door and talk to people about issues , host debates between candidates at the local and parliamentary level, they can also do something about the horrible conditions their university imposes on Sodexo workers and other workers within the university or try and do something to offset the pollution caused by the university. They can try and advocate with their local
MLA so that biswamil which they have a festival named after is not swimming in waist height shit every year. They would find more credibility and gain more popularity if they did any of these things and they would learn more about real world politics than they would doing this performative nonsense. Of course it means leaving their AC classrooms and stepping in to the real world - but they have enough privilege to protect them from serious consequences - they should use it.
Achin Vanaik lecture and Samina dalwai bumble episode and using C word in class are two different issues.
University is justified in inviting Prof Achin Vanaik but not justified in retaining a faculty who who is brainwashed and anti-Hinduism. Who uses cuss words and opens dating app in class
the fact is israeli's want to attacks everyone who is even a tiny bit critical of them, they make accusations of anti semetism, nazi sympathies and what not, which is funny in the context of india becuase most of us would never interact with a jew in our life and have no reason to hate them, if we are critical of israel it's because zionist entity is a colonial project similar to british occupation of India.
they want the same level of control in east as they have in the west.
they want people to loose their jobs and homes for being critical of their atrocities.
The Israeli ambassador to India Naor Gilon also wrote a letter to the vice chancellor, expressing his “concern and extreme disappointment” at Vanaik’s lecture, an event which he alleged delegitimised the state of Israel. He also said he found it “hard to accept” that Dalwai sent out an email that “had named the barbaric atrocities carried out by the Hamas” as fake news.
The controversy has left the class divided, the first law department student said. “Most of us were unhappy about activity around the dating app. However, when [Dalwai] got trolled and attacked over the Palestine lecture, she found support among the students,” they noted.
Around 40 students from different classes have submitted testimonies to the Haryana Women’s commission in support of Dalwai. ....
“She is an upright and straightforward professor but she has been misunderstood,” the third student said. “She wanted to make us understand how the intersectionality of caste and gender applies in our lives.”
But if you’re gonna contextualise “ why in this one instance were Muslims
shouting a religious slogan ? Was it to
Intimidate ?” You have to contextualise it for the JSR folks also - which instance is Dalwai speaking of ? How do we know it was to intimidate ?
If all you learnt from law school was to cling to appeals from authority - you’ve been quite poorly served. I think the actions of Hamas on oct 7 were clearly the actions of a terrorist. If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck - might be a duck. I disagree with you on facts about israels war - I’m unsure we have all the reporting in on how this war is being fought. There is a lot of propaganda from both sides and I refuse to take my news from Instagram. In any case israel is a recognised state for 70 something years now and if they have committed war crimes they should be held accountable. The facts might show that israel has fought this war as well as they can - that they have avoided civilian casualties and focused on returning hostages and destroying Hamas in which case they shouldn’t get condemnation.
Israel has enough fire power to obliterate Gaza today. But in the last few decades Palestinian population has grown instead of declined.
It sure seems to me that it israel was a bigoted genocidal state like nazi Germany - they should be better at the bigotry or the genocide no ?
How many Jews peacefully live in Gaza ? How many Christians? Can gay people become leaders of Hamas ? Can women ?
The stated goal of israel in its founding documents is a peaceful prosperous state - the stated goal of Hamas is to kill the Jews. Why is Israel nazis again?
With regard to October 7, there's a difference between heinous acts and an organisation being acknowledged under domestic law as a terrorist organisation. As a lawyer, you're supposed to be able to identify that difference. I find Hamas' actions to be reprehensible and strongly condemn it. I feel the same way about Israel's retaliation too including all the murdering of innocent civilians and children. If you want to pressurize the Indian government to include Hamas in the list of organisations that we recognise as terrorists, I am all in support. Till then, it is not one at least under Indian law. Otherwise, people would have been arrested for inviting their representatives to air their opinions in programmes.
Do you think oct 7 was a terrorist act? or do you think the rape of women and murder of babies is legitimate resistance? we dont need to appeal to authority when we can simply look at actions to decide no?
1. A university is not meant to be a space for political indoctrination.
2. No professor should shut down voices contrary to theirs.
3. Hamas is a terrorist organisation and the Israel-Palestine issue is not as black and white as the left is making it out to be.
4. Jai Shri Ram is an age-old, religious slogan. The slogan itself cannot become offensive because radical elements use it. By that logic, the same can be said of slogans from Islam and Sikhism.
5. The word "ch***ya" may be a synonym for "fool", but it is a vulgar synonym, similar to saying
"dumbf**k" instead of "fool". Such words should never be used by professors against student.
6. Showing dating profiles of students, or outing students with dating profiles, is never acceptable and a gross violation of privacy and teaching ethics.
Thank you.
Thus, Prof Dalwai's only offence is sticking to the dictionary meaning of the word (also used by Yogi-ji) and not imagining that right-wing students would have a dirty mind where they equate chutiya to mean a vulgar expression for vagina (despite their hero using it in the dictionary sense).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mE_TxipMNxo
-
Misunderstood. How little must you think of the opposition to assume they just went “ hurr durr hate women” when really students might have been uncomfortable opening and commenting on the dating profiles of their friends and fellow students ? I agree with Dalwai that caste and gender play a role in mate selection - wouldn’t showing studies on low rates of intermarriage / showing the matrimonial section of any news paper have done the same job? Wouldn’t assigning a reflective short answer that asked students to think about their own choices do the job ? And even if caste and gender affect mating choices - what exactly are we supposed to do about it ? Should we all collectively guilt ourselves into dating people we don’t feel desirable ? Should we constantly talk about our preferences as if they were prejudices so we’d be seen as morally superior ? The left starts with a good idea and does no follow through. Answer the question - so what ?
When you’re trying to be provocative - should you be surprised that you’ve provoked people ? That one goes for Hamas and Dalwai tbh:
Having said that - I don’t think she should lose her job over the bumble affair. It’s a badly thought out lesson plan but it’s not worthy of firing. She should lose her job for the chutiya stuff. That’s inexcusable.
It’s a curious kind of leftist activism that wants to hide its face and demand that people ask them consent to film speeches given in public forum. It’s stupid to expect speeches given in any public forum to be private or to not be recorded in this day and age. And if you believe what you say - you shouldn’t have trouble with people recording you.
If you feel such shame at what you’re saying that you have to hide your face - consider why that might be. If you want to hide your face because you know many people disagree - consider for a moment that you might not be completely right all the time.
Having said that - right wing students can’t cry about cancel culture if they do the same thing. And recording and sending stuff to op India is cowardly when you could actually use your brains to challenge the argument in the room. You cannot be so convinced of your righteousness/ so drunk on your power that you forget that you come to university to learn and expose yourself to people who might not think like you. The right is not solely guilty of this - but Jgls students take it to extremes.
Left wing students in Jindal need to ask themselves what their priorities are. Are they really willing to risk their credibility on half baked ideas about Palestine / Israel gained from insta reels ? Or defending a professor who has clearly done some objectionable stuff in the classroom ? Or would their time be better spent working on winnable local fights ? Next election is less than a year away- they can do voter registration work in Haryana , go door to door and talk to people about issues , host debates between candidates at the local and parliamentary level, they can also do something about the horrible conditions their university imposes on Sodexo workers and other workers within the university or try and do something to offset the pollution caused by the university. They can try and advocate with their local
MLA so that biswamil which they have a festival named after is not swimming in waist height shit every year. They would find more credibility and gain more popularity if they did any of these things and they would learn more about real world politics than they would doing this performative nonsense. Of course it means leaving their AC classrooms and stepping in to the real world - but they have enough privilege to protect them from serious consequences - they should use it.
University is justified in inviting Prof Achin Vanaik but not justified in retaining a faculty who who is brainwashed and anti-Hinduism. Who uses cuss words and opens dating app in class
they want the same level of control in east as they have in the west.
they want people to loose their jobs and homes for being critical of their atrocities.
The controversy has left the class divided, the first law department student said. “Most of us were unhappy about activity around the dating app. However, when [Dalwai] got trolled and attacked over the Palestine lecture, she found support among the students,” they noted.
Around 40 students from different classes have submitted testimonies to the Haryana Women’s commission in support of Dalwai. ....
“She is an upright and straightforward professor but she has been misunderstood,” the third student said. “She wanted to make us understand how the intersectionality of caste and gender applies in our lives.”
https://scroll.in/article/1059193/from-jindal-university-to-iit-bombay-student-videos-used-to-target-faculty-on-israel-palestine-war