I am a lawyer with few years behind me practicing with a relatively relaxed team in M&A plus PE, etc. Off late, it is becoming impossible to keep up the time sheets, and/or mundane deliverables. Tools and tech has to an extent helped me, but deliverables that can be done by others in few hours usually are taking me into an all-nighter. I stay away from socials and media to conserve my time, but I am lost.
It is not that I am lazy or do nothing, as is usual with cases like ours, with increasing propensity my focus is driven towards other news items, advisory matters (I am golden when you need a opinion, connect the dots). I am however turning into an highly inconsistent and unreliable performer. My team is supportive, however it doesn't make sense to stick around for paycheck if I cannot deliver. I haven't yet found or sought professional help, because I could manage till now. My diagnosis was long ago, and I haven't had trouble even during my studies at law school.
I seek your counsel, because I feel from another thread that few of you seem to be struggling with the issue, plus advise on whether I should maybe pivot to another line of work before it becomes too late.
Hi, hope today has been good so far. I really think you should seek professional help. There's no harm, is there? Just seeking help will make you feel lighter. And I hope your psychologist is able to help you with managing it. Please dont shy off medication if a psychiatrist thinks so. They really do know best and you've got to trust someone at the end of the day. Would also caution you against having unrealistic expectations from therapy or meds. It takes time. But it works.
If you've always had ADHD, you're going to have it at a new job too. Perhaps you'll find something which is more interesting to you and triggers your ADHD less. But it's still gonna be around and it wrecks personal life too (basing this on the books I've read and may I digress and recommend you read any book on it by someone who has it because it is cathartic). ADHD often manifests with anxiety and depression too. I think professional help would be the best. Come to think of it, how different is it from going to a dentist for a RCT or an ophthalmologist to get the power in your glasses changed. Our minds too deserve to be clear and without pain. All the very best!
Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder (ADHD) is pretty hard to actually self-diagnose in all cases and is perhaps overdiagnosed a lot too by professionals, though it might be possible to tell if you're on the spectrum. Why are you scared?
I am a lawyer with 8 years PQE. Absolutely screwed up my grades at law school due to what I know now is ADHD. Did better than college at work because there was always the threat of a deadline that I was fighting.
Started in litigation for a couple of years and have now spent 6 years in dispute resolution at a Tier 1. I have always been an incessant procastinator and very unorganised but also had the ability to focus for very very long hours when I needed to, or if I was somehow interested in the work that I was doing.
Always screwed up the bare minimum compliances like timesheets, and crap admin work, and the grunt work but survived because I like my work and my brain works really well in a focused manner if it is intellectually engaging work. Especially when it comes to very large complex matters, my ADHD brain also would really get deep into a matter, because of the "hyperfocus" associated with our brains. That is how survived at the firm, but due to all the last minute work I put myself through huge amounts of anxiety and mental and physical health issues. I was always really efficient on the good and interesting days but really struggled with doing the bare minimum on bad or boring days.
Got diagnosed a couple of years ago after discussing my entire life and tendencies with a therapist and finally made it to a psychiatrist. Medication changed my life. It is not an automatic switch but improves my ability to do the average amount of focus I need to get through the bad and dull day. And therapy and planning helped me get a bit better organised to deal with things like losing keys, forgetting to send an email etc. To anyone else reading this, it can get better and do get help. Maybe medication won't help everyone to the extent it helped me but reading resources about ADHD online and then getting help helped me at least loathe myself a little less and started the long process of being more functional.
Medication is a bit of controversy on whether it works and also it can have long term effects, heard it from someone else.I am not ADHD, just sharing what I heard.
This is a great write up. I would think there would be a quite a few of us at our daily corporate job feeling like this. The way this is expressed is brilliant. Your evaluation is on point and highlights both the struggle and the issues that faces those with this issue. Law Firms across India have started focussing a lot on mental health issues. ADHD is something though which seems like is a baggage we enter this profession with and then have to deal with it because of the requirements of the profession which requires hours of reading and drafting. This is a very interesting topic, and I hope readers keep commenting.
I know my answer isn't offering any practical solution but just so you know: it's not something wrong with you. It is us who have developed a society where we make full-bodied human beings sit inside a 2ftx2ft cubicle in front a screen with funny lights and then expect them to be good at it. And then make it mandatory for all their waking hours if they want to earn enough to sustain.
Suggest a platform. How can we do it safely/ privately and anonymously? Discord? Something like that?
I feel like ADHD folks can help each other a lot. Somewhat like apes strong together. I've always felt like I need a push from someone. Not just anyone but someone who understands how lethargic/unmotivated/procrastinating a person with ADHD can feel sometimes.
Hi Fellow Lawyer, I don't think anything has been started as of yet.
Do you have any ideas on what forum we can use?
In the meantime, I've been reading Scattered Minds by Gabor Mate. It's very informative and helpful. Also gave me a perspective that I may only have a mild ADHD. Especially when compared with others. Probably why I could do without medication or professional help. However, somedays, the motivation just runs out. I'm finding it increasingly hard to battle procrastination, keep myself focused and abstain from over-indulgence (food/alcohol).
Even tried being sober. Successfully completed a month. It did not help with my low motivation problem though.
I have ADHD, too. Try to put yourself in a high pressure environment - not too high. It really helps to get your job done. Not feeling like reading? Go to the library. Procrastinating work? Set a short deadline with repercussions.
Take food with pauses. Do not gobble it down too fast. Also, learn what junk and top much card does to your body - get disgusted. You will eventually eat healthy stuff.
All of this is anecdotal, it may not work for you.
I've got an update. I started a page on fishbowl. I haven't used the app at all and I am still a beginner at it. However, I think fishbowl is the app which comes closest in terms of offering anonymity and credibility.
Credibility in the sense that - It needs your LinkedIn to be connected - What this does is, at least to an extent, prevent random trolls from joining by creating a first layer of screening (I love memes but the last thing we all need is a bunch of kids from law school signing on as Mukul Goyal and posting hi dear or trolling us when we need help). Second layer of screening will be enforced when a join request is put in.
Anonymity - Because you can choose how much you reveal about yourself each time you comment or post. It can just read “Associate/ SA/ Partner” and thats it. Here's the catch though - I haven't tested it out yet but I might be able to see your name and firm name when you put in a request to join. Still don't know if there is a workaround for this. Please let me know if there is. Beyond looking at your details (when I approve the join request), I still won’t be able to see what a particular person has posted or who has posted what unless you choose to. On this note - I concur that none of you know me and, therefore, it is not fair for me to ask you to place your trust in me blindly. However, what I can tell you is this - I care a lot about my own anonymity. I will not back-track you on LinkedIn or anywhere else because that will blow my cover too. Don't ask me why, but I am just a very private person.
The intent behind this page is - To create a safe space where we can help each other out anonymously on a real-time basis. A place when similarly placed individuals/ professionals can find support and strength.
TL:DR - Apes strong together.
Let me know if this works for you guys and I will post the joining link.
Also please suggest as to how the bowl can be made more robust.
Hi! I am a lawyer PQE 8 and have been suffering from ADHD for over a decade now. It is a terrible thing to have. But there are two things I will recommend (1) Medication. Trust me. It helps and it works. Speak to your psychiatrist. (2) Talk Therapy to help you develop coping mechanisms that suit you.
Since I quit working in a law firm and eating and sleeping well, I realised my adhd tendencies have really reduced.
It's a mixture of good sleep (which included learning sleep hygiene and actually prioritising and valuing sleep), good healthy food (I've stopped eating outside except really occasionally), exercising daily, and ensuring my B12, VitD3, Omega 3s are all in order.
As a starting point, get a blood test done and see if you need to focus on any specific thing first (Vit D, B12, etc). If you feel this is a recent thing then it could be your body telling you something is amiss.
Can we start a support group in Mumbai for lawyers with ADHD?
It can be a monthly or weekly meeting and people who are comfortable attending it may do so and just exchange life stories and talk about how they are handling life as a lawyer with ADHD and coping with various situations.
If offline doesn't work maybe have similar session on Zoom where those who are comfortable can join in and the rest can maintain anonymity and still participate.
Again, I am only thinking out loud and open to other ideas. Just feel like something should be done given so many of us are struggling.
Hi - I'm a tier 1 law firm corporate lawyer with 4 PQE from a tier 1 law school. I cannot to begin to tell you how much I cried the day I got my adhd diagnosis because every single thing in my life made sense, professionally, personally and academically. I want to share my journey and everything that has helped me and I am absolutely in love with the idea of a forum to talk about navigating adhd as lawyers and find the much needed solidarity we ADHDers need. Can we perhaps try reddit? Although it is so over-stimulating that some might be discouraged to use it. We can also use google group but that may require using our personal email ids. I can see that this idea has been on the back burner for almost a year and I am very excited and eager (hello adhd) to make this happen.
After reading these comments, I feel I may be having ADHD. I get extremely focussed bouts when the task is complex. On the other hand, I find even the simplest tasks like filling timesheets or sending 1 liner emails difficult. At times when the conversation is not interesting or is moving in circles, I loose attention to the extent that I m not even able to register what the other person is saying. I am also quite irritable. I get irritated even if spiral binding is not done properly - for e.g. the plastic binding wire doesn't reach the last whole
Wow so much of what is written resonated with me. I will read up more on this. I tend to not be able to work long spans of times and am terrible at administrative tasks. I have tried to manage by taking frequent breaks and working longer hours to complete work with quite a few breaks.
I am working in the M&A team of a tier I law firm in Mumbai and I have been recently diagnosed with ADHD (had a proper clinical evaluation from a psychiatrist). For a long time my understanding has been that maybe I am in a bad team and the people don't really understand how hard I work and they just criticize me for small things and so I changed teams and law firms a couple of times and realized that some issues were just constant for me and that made me realize that it can't always be the team, it's probably just me.
Things like time management and meeting deadlines are so difficult and then reading so many documents become so exhausting. Taking/following instructions like the way partners and seniors give instructions in law firms is difficult for me to catch and follow and as a result I often end up doing things incorrectly. The motivation to start working is never there and even when I know it's a simple thing which I can finish on time, I leave it for later because I don't have the energy/motivation to start it.
It's not like I am not trying, I know I work very hard and I try to do things correctly to the best of my ability. I know I take longer to get work done so I put in extra late nights so that I am on time with my work. But no matter what I do, I am unable to do things correctly and seniors are always telling me how my work is not perfect and how that's not acceptable. And I like the work so it can't be because I have no interest in the work I do. Unfortunately, because of another underlying medical issue, I can't take certain medication including some usually used for ADHD.
These things in school and college had no major consequences but in law firms these issues have consequences and before I know it, I will become that associate who is bad with work and have a reputation. I am always anxious and stressed and that has it's own impact on health.
I found this thread recently and I understand there are corporate lawyers here who have lived through this and I want to seek some guidance with regards to what I should do and what alternatives I may have here? Would really appreciate some help as I am really struggling.
I am a law grad with adhd who is in dire need of some guidance. Can one of you help? It would be nice to just chat and share my concerns with someone who understands. :)
I am a lawyer with few years behind me practicing with a relatively relaxed team in M&A plus PE, etc. Off late, it is becoming impossible to keep up the time sheets, and/or mundane deliverables. Tools and tech has to an extent helped me, but deliverables that can be done by others in few hours usually are taking me into an all-nighter. I stay away from socials and media to conserve my time, but I am lost.
It is not that I am lazy or do nothing, as is usual with cases like ours, with increasing propensity my focus is driven towards other news items, advisory matters (I am golden when you need a opinion, connect the dots). I am however turning into an highly inconsistent and unreliable performer. My team is supportive, however it doesn't make sense to stick around for paycheck if I cannot deliver. I haven't yet found or sought professional help, because I could manage till now. My diagnosis was long ago, and I haven't had trouble even during my studies at law school.
I seek your counsel, because I feel from another thread that few of you seem to be struggling with the issue, plus advise on whether I should maybe pivot to another line of work before it becomes too late.
[Prior longer ADHD Thread here, for reference: https://www.legallyindia.com/convos/topic/186810-Lawyers-with-ADHD- ]
If you've always had ADHD, you're going to have it at a new job too. Perhaps you'll find something which is more interesting to you and triggers your ADHD less. But it's still gonna be around and it wrecks personal life too (basing this on the books I've read and may I digress and recommend you read any book on it by someone who has it because it is cathartic). ADHD often manifests with anxiety and depression too. I think professional help would be the best. Come to think of it, how different is it from going to a dentist for a RCT or an ophthalmologist to get the power in your glasses changed. Our minds too deserve to be clear and without pain. All the very best!
Started in litigation for a couple of years and have now spent 6 years in dispute resolution at a Tier 1. I have always been an incessant procastinator and very unorganised but also had the ability to focus for very very long hours when I needed to, or if I was somehow interested in the work that I was doing.
Always screwed up the bare minimum compliances like timesheets, and crap admin work, and the grunt work but survived because I like my work and my brain works really well in a focused manner if it is intellectually engaging work. Especially when it comes to very large complex matters, my ADHD brain also would really get deep into a matter, because of the "hyperfocus" associated with our brains.
That is how survived at the firm, but due to all the last minute work I put myself through huge amounts of anxiety and mental and physical health issues. I was always really efficient on the good and interesting days but really struggled with doing the bare minimum on bad or boring days.
Got diagnosed a couple of years ago after discussing my entire life and tendencies with a therapist and finally made it to a psychiatrist. Medication changed my life. It is not an automatic switch but improves my ability to do the average amount of focus I need to get through the bad and dull day. And therapy and planning helped me get a bit better organised to deal with things like losing keys, forgetting to send an email etc. To anyone else reading this, it can get better and do get help. Maybe medication won't help everyone to the extent it helped me but reading resources about ADHD online and then getting help helped me at least loathe myself a little less and started the long process of being more functional.
This is a great write up. I would think there would be a quite a few of us at our daily corporate job feeling like this. The way this is expressed is brilliant. Your evaluation is on point and highlights both the struggle and the issues that faces those with this issue. Law Firms across India have started focussing a lot on mental health issues. ADHD is something though which seems like is a baggage we enter this profession with and then have to deal with it because of the requirements of the profession which requires hours of reading and drafting. This is a very interesting topic, and I hope readers keep commenting.
~ R
I feel like ADHD folks can help each other a lot. Somewhat like apes strong together. I've always felt like I need a push from someone. Not just anyone but someone who understands how lethargic/unmotivated/procrastinating a person with ADHD can feel sometimes.
Do you have any ideas on what forum we can use?
In the meantime, I've been reading Scattered Minds by Gabor Mate. It's very informative and helpful. Also gave me a perspective that I may only have a mild ADHD. Especially when compared with others. Probably why I could do without medication or professional help. However, somedays, the motivation just runs out. I'm finding it increasingly hard to battle procrastination, keep myself focused and abstain from over-indulgence (food/alcohol).
Even tried being sober. Successfully completed a month. It did not help with my low motivation problem though.
Take food with pauses. Do not gobble it down too fast. Also, learn what junk and top much card does to your body - get disgusted. You will eventually eat healthy stuff.
All of this is anecdotal, it may not work for you.
Credibility in the sense that - It needs your LinkedIn to be connected - What this does is, at least to an extent, prevent random trolls from joining by creating a first layer of screening (I love memes but the last thing we all need is a bunch of kids from law school signing on as Mukul Goyal and posting hi dear or trolling us when we need help). Second layer of screening will be enforced when a join request is put in.
Anonymity - Because you can choose how much you reveal about yourself each time you comment or post. It can just read “Associate/ SA/ Partner” and thats it. Here's the catch though - I haven't tested it out yet but I might be able to see your name and firm name when you put in a request to join. Still don't know if there is a workaround for this. Please let me know if there is.
Beyond looking at your details (when I approve the join request), I still won’t be able to see what a particular person has posted or who has posted what unless you choose to.
On this note - I concur that none of you know me and, therefore, it is not fair for me to ask you to place your trust in me blindly. However, what I can tell you is this - I care a lot about my own anonymity. I will not back-track you on LinkedIn or anywhere else because that will blow my cover too. Don't ask me why, but I am just a very private person.
The intent behind this page is - To create a safe space where we can help each other out anonymously on a real-time basis. A place when similarly placed individuals/ professionals can find support and strength.
TL:DR - Apes strong together.
Let me know if this works for you guys and I will post the joining link.
Also please suggest as to how the bowl can be made more robust.
I hope you get well soon.
They help you get your centre back.
It's a mixture of good sleep (which included learning sleep hygiene and actually prioritising and valuing sleep), good healthy food (I've stopped eating outside except really occasionally), exercising daily, and ensuring my B12, VitD3, Omega 3s are all in order.
As a starting point, get a blood test done and see if you need to focus on any specific thing first (Vit D, B12, etc). If you feel this is a recent thing then it could be your body telling you something is amiss.
Cheers
It can be a monthly or weekly meeting and people who are comfortable attending it may do so and just exchange life stories and talk about how they are handling life as a lawyer with ADHD and coping with various situations.
If offline doesn't work maybe have similar session on Zoom where those who are comfortable can join in and the rest can maintain anonymity and still participate.
Again, I am only thinking out loud and open to other ideas. Just feel like something should be done given so many of us are struggling.
I get extremely focussed bouts when the task is complex. On the other hand, I find even the simplest tasks like filling timesheets or sending 1 liner emails difficult. At times when the conversation is not interesting or is moving in circles, I loose attention to the extent that I m not even able to register what the other person is saying. I am also quite irritable. I get irritated even if spiral binding is not done properly - for e.g. the plastic binding wire doesn't reach the last whole
Things like time management and meeting deadlines are so difficult and then reading so many documents become so exhausting. Taking/following instructions like the way partners and seniors give instructions in law firms is difficult for me to catch and follow and as a result I often end up doing things incorrectly. The motivation to start working is never there and even when I know it's a simple thing which I can finish on time, I leave it for later because I don't have the energy/motivation to start it.
It's not like I am not trying, I know I work very hard and I try to do things correctly to the best of my ability. I know I take longer to get work done so I put in extra late nights so that I am on time with my work. But no matter what I do, I am unable to do things correctly and seniors are always telling me how my work is not perfect and how that's not acceptable. And I like the work so it can't be because I have no interest in the work I do. Unfortunately, because of another underlying medical issue, I can't take certain medication including some usually used for ADHD.
These things in school and college had no major consequences but in law firms these issues have consequences and before I know it, I will become that associate who is bad with work and have a reputation. I am always anxious and stressed and that has it's own impact on health.
I found this thread recently and I understand there are corporate lawyers here who have lived through this and I want to seek some guidance with regards to what I should do and what alternatives I may have here? Would really appreciate some help as I am really struggling.
I am a law grad with adhd who is in dire need of some guidance. Can one of you help? It would be nice to just chat and share my concerns with someone who understands. :)