What wrong we have if we want to study law at NLUs and have not completed our education from those "elite schools"? Till this date I've serious lacunae in my communicative skills, but I hope to improve it at law school. Perhaps add a 6 month preparatory course to address the issue.
On what basis, let's just say both exams are taking place in an offline medium, on what basis do you suggest CLAT is better than LSAT. It's a standardized aptitude test and just like the OP said other than a slightly elevated level of English doesn't really have any shortcoming irrespective of who the exam taker is. CLAT on the other hand hardly has any standard. In 2011, when NUJS conducted the exam, it had such long comprehension, given the time constraint, it was almost impossible to go through the entire thing in one go. In between, it had paper leaked, questions out of prescribed syllabus, wrong answers used in the answer key, terrible UX and what not. Everything that can go wrong has gone wrong and yet you call it a better exam. On what parameter its better is all I want to know.
Don't say more folks give CLAT, because if NLUs shift to LSAT, more folks would be giving LSAT (infact LSAT is likely to become much cheaper and if not cheaper, NLUs still can make a boatload of money by cutting deal with Pearson) and also move away from facing the indignity of not being able to manage an exam which is not given by even 100,000 students, and yes that is a trivial number compared to the scale at which competitive exams take place in India.
This is just complete falsehood and trolling. First of all, how do you know about the overall background of NLU students in general outside your own university? Secondly, your conclusions are laughable and nowhere near the truth. There are plenty of students in NLUs who have come from privileged background, just as there are those who come from other backgrounds. The fact that you think strong English skill is a pre-law prerequisite itself has been debunked plenty of times. And if you think mentorship in NLUs is only needed for English training, that clearly shows that you have never managed to go anywhere near the NLUs. "Not being elitist here?" Your prejudice is visible in every statement that you made. Frankly, nobody needs your kind in the NLUs. Give your dear LSAT, go to Jindal, and spare the rest of us your distorted worldview.
As an entrance exam to public universities in a developing country like ours, it sure is. I've got no issue with JGLS, by the way. They are welcome to use whichever entrance exam they choose. They are a private institution, and not accountable to the general public as such other than to their own students. Therefore, your assumption is completely wrong.
Next time I hear the "villagers have no computers" argument I'm gonna bang my head into the wall! The people writing such comments are deluded rich liberals in metro cities who think rural India lives in the 17th century and worship the socialist "povertarian" policies which have dragged India down. Any rural kid can access a tablet/laptop today and if not then one can easily donate one to them. Please also be practical. A rural kid who does not use a computer and does not attend CLAT coaching has at best 1% chance of clearing CLAT. Stop this mindless socialist BS.
LSAT is a better test. LSAT tests you on logic and English comprehension skills, which are more important than memorising GK, memorising Bangia tort cases for "legal knowledge" and solving maths problems (go to IIT if you are such a maths wiz).
The current crop of NLU students have really weak English skills because they have not attended schools where English is taught well. Not being elitist here, it's a fact and even NLUs themselves admit it and have set up mentoring. The early crop of NLU students were mostly alumni of elite schools in Mumbai, Delhi, Bengaluru, Chennai, Kolkata Hyderabad, Pune etc, plus elite residential schools. These days you can count on one hand how many students are from the top 10 cities, leave alone elite schools.
That argument is fallacious. There are plenty of places in this country where you cannot get stable internet connection for giving such an exam unless you are ready to shell out a lot of money. Plus not having a laptop usually means one is not very well trained in using it either. Renting one on the day of the exam or a week before is simply not enough. Traveling is still relatively cheap in this country unless people are focusing on comfort and convenience. Just because you are from a small town and have or have not faced a set of barriers, that doesn't make you the spokesperson for all the others who lack access. Your argument about the demographics is also incorrect. Even if there are 10% of NLU students who come from areas and backgrounds not conducive to access, that means a lot more people similarly placed would give the exam. I have happened to teach many of them via IDIA and other organisations. All of them would suffer from online exams. I'm not discounting your own experience, just pointing out that there are others who have had other experiences.
The only place where I’d disagree with you is where you imply that online exams are not accessible. I have stated this on a different thread as well, online exams might as well be more accessible. I come from a small town and was not able to appear for a lot of exams because these centres were far away in major cities. The cost of renting a laptop or getting internet connection was for more cheaper than the travel costs associated. Also I can’t find the link but there was this survey about where do students of NLUs mostly hail from, at the top were metropolitan cities and other major cities like lucknow and jaipur etc. There is negligible representation or accessibility to people from smaller towns and online exams make that possible.
1. About the money, no use complaining or comparing it with JEE. NLUs don't get proper government funding unlike the IITs or Med Schools. This is one of their key sources of funding. If you have to build consensus, focus it on the NLUs getting nationalised. Both fees and CLAT registration fees would come down.
2. Agree with the GK issue. Legal reasoning isn't that necessary as logical reasoning is at entry level. Maths unfortunately is needed, at least the basic maths that CLAT tests. As a transactional lawyer, I've found that my numerical aptitude has kept me ahead of at least a part of my colleagues. Even studying Economics and Corp Finance in law school becomes easier.
3. As for coaching for CLAT and LSAT, I had given both without coaching and cleared both. It is possible. I won't deny that I had certain privileges like English medium education, computer training, good reading habit etc.
To start with CLAT charges 4,000 bucks, even LSAT India is charging less and that says something. I can give JEE & NEET together for half the amount. Second is the structure of the exam. --GK - They ask the most random stuff. Does it really help me as a lawyer to know which Indian city won the 'Cleanest city Award' consecutively for 3 years? Might as well do a coin toss. --Legal Aptitude - So I need to know the law before doing law. What is even the point of doing this? -- Maths - When was the last time you needed your maths skill as a lawyer? Even our courts have a hard time when it comes to maths (https://scroll.in/article/726894/how-the-numbers-dont-add-up-in-the-jayalalithaa-case-did-the-karnataka-high-court-get-its-maths-wrong)
And, then there is the terrible administration of the exam, year after year. We understand that all of these NLUs want the money pot, but can't they just make one permanent CLAT body for the exam which does it year after year instead of the current torture that is meted out now.
On second thoughts, LSAT India, on its merits is actually a better exam to judge the candidature of potential law students. Anyone with the right mindset can crack it without having to go for expensive coaching. The only part that is problematic is the English portion as it tends to be much more difficult than CLAT and as a result, will disproportionately impact students from not so affluent background. In its current online edition, of course, it is inaccessible to a large no of candidates but since any change is unlikely to happen this year, and hopefully by the time Covid gets over and these exams can take place in physical spaces again, someone here with clout can see this and do something about it.
AILET also suffers from the same issue as CLAT. I haven't given SLAT so can't comment on it. Cannot think of any other major law entrance exam.
CLAT on the other hand hardly has any standard. In 2011, when NUJS conducted the exam, it had such long comprehension, given the time constraint, it was almost impossible to go through the entire thing in one go. In between, it had paper leaked, questions out of prescribed syllabus, wrong answers used in the answer key, terrible UX and what not. Everything that can go wrong has gone wrong and yet you call it a better exam. On what parameter its better is all I want to know.
Don't say more folks give CLAT, because if NLUs shift to LSAT, more folks would be giving LSAT (infact LSAT is likely to become much cheaper and if not cheaper, NLUs still can make a boatload of money by cutting deal with Pearson) and also move away from facing the indignity of not being able to manage an exam which is not given by even 100,000 students, and yes that is a trivial number compared to the scale at which competitive exams take place in India.
It's basically like American exams like SAT and GRE.
The current crop of NLU students have really weak English skills because they have not attended schools where English is taught well. Not being elitist here, it's a fact and even NLUs themselves admit it and have set up mentoring. The early crop of NLU students were mostly alumni of elite schools in Mumbai, Delhi, Bengaluru, Chennai, Kolkata Hyderabad, Pune etc, plus elite residential schools. These days you can count on one hand how many students are from the top 10 cities, leave alone elite schools.
2. Agree with the GK issue. Legal reasoning isn't that necessary as logical reasoning is at entry level. Maths unfortunately is needed, at least the basic maths that CLAT tests. As a transactional lawyer, I've found that my numerical aptitude has kept me ahead of at least a part of my colleagues. Even studying Economics and Corp Finance in law school becomes easier.
3. As for coaching for CLAT and LSAT, I had given both without coaching and cleared both. It is possible. I won't deny that I had certain privileges like English medium education, computer training, good reading habit etc.
Second is the structure of the exam.
--GK - They ask the most random stuff. Does it really help me as a lawyer to know which Indian city won the 'Cleanest city Award' consecutively for 3 years? Might as well do a coin toss.
--Legal Aptitude - So I need to know the law before doing law. What is even the point of doing this?
-- Maths - When was the last time you needed your maths skill as a lawyer? Even our courts have a hard time when it comes to maths (https://scroll.in/article/726894/how-the-numbers-dont-add-up-in-the-jayalalithaa-case-did-the-karnataka-high-court-get-its-maths-wrong)
And, then there is the terrible administration of the exam, year after year. We understand that all of these NLUs want the money pot, but can't they just make one permanent CLAT body for the exam which does it year after year instead of the current torture that is meted out now.
On second thoughts, LSAT India, on its merits is actually a better exam to judge the candidature of potential law students. Anyone with the right mindset can crack it without having to go for expensive coaching. The only part that is problematic is the English portion as it tends to be much more difficult than CLAT and as a result, will disproportionately impact students from not so affluent background.
In its current online edition, of course, it is inaccessible to a large no of candidates but since any change is unlikely to happen this year, and hopefully by the time Covid gets over and these exams can take place in physical spaces again, someone here with clout can see this and do something about it.
AILET also suffers from the same issue as CLAT. I haven't given SLAT so can't comment on it. Cannot think of any other major law entrance exam.