A certain faculty room in NUJS has banned students wearing shorts from entering their room. It is noteworthy that inter alia 2 (recent-ish) NLU grads sit in that room. Absolutely shameful.
These people dont realise that with absolutely no ac common spaces for students, calcutta heat is unbearable except for 3 odd months in a year. Shorts and loose clothing are necessary for survival. Even if not for survival shorts or no shorts is not something they get to decide.
Apparantly for them, shorts are disrespectful... Idk how. This is not a court or office. I understand shorts would not be acceptable in a place where formal clothing is expected but a college campus is not such a place.
Dress codes may be mandated for an event or certain spaces in campus or the entire campus altogether. But that is something that should result out of some due process and should culminate in a formal document. "wEaR fuLL pAnTs oR dOnT sUbMiT pRoJeCt" dictats are just not the way to go forward with this.
Here comes the keyboard warrior again. Every faculty has the right to expect formal dresses in their own rooms. You don't get to dictate your standards on them, and you trying to do so is as big a violation of their right as you are trying to perpetrate this as yours. Don't talk rubbish about heat etc. You wear full formal dresses in that same heat when you wish to impress others like recruiters or moot judges. The faculty can have the same expectation of you as the latter can. You saying that they can't have such expectations doesn't really mean anything, since you don't get to make those rules. You are not being asked to wear pants inside classroom or common space. The faculty's room isn't your common space. You don't want to wear pants, don't go to their room. You spout random phrases like due process without understanding anything about it. You actually tried to rile students up about this, failed miserably and have returned to LI to vent your frustration. Better spend all this energy on attending classes or studying, so that you don't have to go begging for exemption to the VC one day before the exam. If you are that certain that you are in the right, then why not file a formal complaint against the faculty? See where that takes you. You want to take everyone around you casually except the people whom you want to impress, that's on you.
How much sadistic anxiety can a faculty have in enforcing such trivialities. No wonder Indian National Law universities are is such a pathetic state. I've never heard of Harvard, or Yale, or NUS ever having such rules, and anyone who knows anything about these, and most other places, will inform you that students wear shorts and are allowed their liberty to choose their clothing. Stupid, insecure, Faculty trying to superimpose their rigid notions of professionalism. Be a good teacher, and you will earn respect of students. Impose things ridiculously, and you expose your frailties.
I know of many professors in those very universities you named, who require students to dress professionally before granting them an appointment to meet on a one to one basis. So your notion of what's acceptable elsewhere is flawed. What those places don't have is a dress code for classrooms and common parts of the campus. Nor does NUJS. If you wish to retain your right of dressing the way you want to, then the faculty retains the right to receive only those people in their room who would put in as much effort as she wants them to. It's part of the same right. If you refuse to acknowledge that, then you are a pseudo-liberal and pseudo-woke.
As for it being pathetic, so is your effort to dress up for law firm partners. Or are you claiming that you should also be allowed to give your interviews in shorts? You aren't.
Pray tell the name of one individual faculty that mandates a dress code before entering their office?
And it's silly to equate faculty to law firm partners. A place of education is for students to learn in a open, holistic, convivial and conducive atmosphere. Not a restrained cottage industry. Equating the two defeats the very purpose of an education that allows freedom. What if the student does not want to enter a law firm? Why force down law firm expectations indiscriminately?
You would wear the same formal dresses in that place of education while meeting some people, as opposed to others. I think that's what was meant. I am not the OP. Personally, I won't like that stance by any teacher, but can't help agreeing that it would be their right to demand that within their own rooms so long as they are not trying to impose that in places where the student has a right to be in, like classrooms, exam halls, common rooms, mess etc. As for some people not willing to join law firms, that's not really the point, is it? You would do that for any recruiter or during events.
educational spaces are not your home. Theyre professional spaces. Professors arent your parents for you to rebel against. Theyre doing a job. Thats all it is. Its completely fair for them to expect professional behavior from students in turn. All this open holistic nonsense you do when you start a university. State run universities require students to participate with some dignity and professionalism. Its not about law firm expectations- any workplace- ngo, trial court- whatever- any professional environment will have a dress code. Its a uniform. Its so that your wealth, class, your gender, your sexuality, your identity- matters less in that space as opposed to you being a professional. Same thing in university spaces. Professors are people and will have biases- some professors may like students who show skin, some may not. Some students may be more comfortable in casual athleisure and others may not. Some may want to show off the brands they wear and others may just prefer to wear simple but professional clothes. The dresscode in part addresses all of these situations and ensure fair and equitable treatment. Adults understand that there is no complete freedom for a man once he leaves his own house. your rights end where someone elses nose begins. Grow up.
Dude. Remove your head from where it is and please see the world. You pretend as if this is common but forget that this is mandate of parochial nonsense uncommon to most law schools. Dress codes for events make sense, but for everyday just seems bizarre and weird. And "professionalism" is not this high-handed catch-all justification that you think it is. Because a legitimate argument is that the kind of professionalism expected in a law school is categorically and essentially different, for good reason, from a law firm. what is with this anxiety with students showing skin? Sounds really creepy for a justification.
Just so it's clear, there is no dress codes at most reputed law schools for day to day activities.
haha. I went there, you idiot. Not everything is the patriarchy, i'm a woman and i think feminists know that. Dress codes help women navigate tricky situations in the workplace. Its a uniform. And BTW law schools are the most conservative spaces on these campuses. No one is asking you to wear sarees or dress in Burberry and heels. Just don't be half-naked. Your source is- a blog? Did that person even go to hls? no one on Harvards Law School campus roams around in shorts. It's seen as downmarket and uncouth. Shorts are for running, the gym, or a day out shopping/ drinking/ beach day. they're not for class.
Here is harvard laws website guidance for an executive programme: https://hls.harvard.edu/executive-education/about-executive-education/frequently-asked-questions/ "Dress for programs is business casual. The environment is professional, but we encourage participants to be comfortable. Local temperatures often fluctuate throughout the day, so we encourage participants to dress in layers. Most programs have a final celebratory dinner at which business attire is appropriate."
Here is the arts school- the liberal hippies- this is how they expect their students to dress up for show shifts: https://ofa.fas.harvard.edu/files/ofa/files/student_dress_code.pdf "Show Shifts: DO WEAR: nice pants or jeans, clean clothes with no rips, holes or tears; button down shirts, sweaters, turtlenecks, collared shirts, polo shirts, dressy short or long sleeved shirts; khakis, dress pants, skirts; Think business casual. DON’T WEAR: t-shirts, t-shirts or shirts with writing or logos, cutoffs, shorts, anything ripped, holey or torn, sleeveless shirts, belly shirts, tank tops, flip flops or sloppy sandals. Formal shows will be marked as "Dress Up" on the Show Shift Calendar which will indicate that it is a no jeans show - so dress pants, khakis, shirts, sweaters, button down shirts, etc. are appropriate, but, obviously, no jeans. For all shifts, including Booth or Phone Shifts: Please be neat, clean and well groomed. Do not wear revealing clothing with shirts with inappropriate content. Please also eschew sweat clothes, pajamas, baseball caps and any attire that may be considered inappropriate. "
"Dress on campus is overall pretty casual. A few deans or central admin folks may wear business formal attire, but most profs dress casual or business casual, and students generally dress casual. You may get a very few older male profs that wear a sport coat.
There will be slightly more formal dress in the law school or the business school, and less formal in FAS or SEAS."
There is a world of difference between business casual / casual and shorts.
Strangely, that's exactly what you are also arguing for, assuming you have the same point as the person who posted this thread. Both the sides are more alike in this matter in terms of their approach than they would care to admit.
Haha. I went to harvard- A prof there frowned at me because I wore sandals to class once. Fully clothed- he thought open toed shoes were too much. You have no idea what youre talking about.
You are again trying to pass it off as moral policing so as to get the wokes enraged. The issue is a different one. The faculty wants you to put the same effort to meet them as you do when you meet others whom you deem important. That's not moral policing at all. You may disagree with that perspective, but don't try to fit it into your version of alt-truth. If you don't want to make that effort, then don't go into her room. If you have to meet other faculty in that room, then tell them that you're not comfortable meeting them there, unless they say that they agree with that faculty's stance. If they do, then they have the same right. If they don't, then it's up to them to make alternate arrangements or get other rooms for themselves, or protest against that faculty. Approach it from a strategic and ordered point, instead of raving and ranting.
My theory is that they misread the memo from the TMC. Only light-brown khaki shorts are banned, not other types of shorts. I hope this will get clarified soon.
This isnt moral policing. This is a dress code. Its quite common to have them in any sort of professional environment which is what a university is. Please get over yourself no one wants to look at you when youre half naked. Its weird that you want to bully people into looking at you when youre in your bed/gym clothes too- whats up with that? a little exhibitionist no?
You’ve never left your corner of the world and you want me to list off professors. Why ? Why are you so sure you’re right ? You do realise Harvard has a number of private clubs with a way stricter dress code than that even ? There are places to eat where you have to wear a dinner jacket and places to watch entertainment where you’re expected to wear formal wear? Not even professional spaces these are explicitly spaces for leisure. Can’t go on the golf course in a suit and can’t go to the opera in shorts. Go to a yacht party without appropriate clothing and have the wait staff sneer at you. Private dining rooms that require formal wear are all too common.
It was Tribe actually. I wasn’t offended - a dress code is a dress code. We just came from different cultures. Grow up kid.
New England has a Mediterranean climate? since when? It has hot summers and cold winters. Its not California. You keep moving those goalposts along. I bet you any money there are unspoken dress codes at Stanford as much as Harvard. This is just a professionalism thing, not a weather thing. If you're running so hot that wearing pants causes you such distress- you should see a doctor. or a psychiatrist.
You don’t believe in consent anymore ? Why should grown adults have to look at you - a child - in states of undress because you refuse to put clothes on ? You’re the one obsessed with clothing here. Everyone else just wants you to show a modicum of professionalism. Work out your daddy issues already. This is embarrassing.
Just to be an ass, I'd wear transperant pants (the ones you'd wear as raincoat) with shorts underneath to mess around. But that would of course backfire
These people dont realise that with absolutely no ac common spaces for students, calcutta heat is unbearable except for 3 odd months in a year. Shorts and loose clothing are necessary for survival. Even if not for survival shorts or no shorts is not something they get to decide.
Apparantly for them, shorts are disrespectful... Idk how. This is not a court or office. I understand shorts would not be acceptable in a place where formal clothing is expected but a college campus is not such a place.
Dress codes may be mandated for an event or certain spaces in campus or the entire campus altogether. But that is something that should result out of some due process and should culminate in a formal document. "wEaR fuLL pAnTs oR dOnT sUbMiT pRoJeCt" dictats are just not the way to go forward with this.
Try something like this!
As for it being pathetic, so is your effort to dress up for law firm partners. Or are you claiming that you should also be allowed to give your interviews in shorts? You aren't.
And it's silly to equate faculty to law firm partners. A place of education is for students to learn in a open, holistic, convivial and conducive atmosphere. Not a restrained cottage industry. Equating the two defeats the very purpose of an education that allows freedom. What if the student does not want to enter a law firm? Why force down law firm expectations indiscriminately?
Just so it's clear, there is no dress codes at most reputed law schools for day to day activities.
Harvard ( for instance) https://www.rileyv.com/legallyblondeaf-blog/law-school-casual-attire
Here is harvard laws website guidance for an executive programme: https://hls.harvard.edu/executive-education/about-executive-education/frequently-asked-questions/
"Dress for programs is business casual. The environment is professional, but we encourage participants to be comfortable. Local temperatures often fluctuate throughout the day, so we encourage participants to dress in layers. Most programs have a final celebratory dinner at which business attire is appropriate."
Here is their website on how to dress for career fairs: https://hls.harvard.edu/bernard-koteen-office-of-public-interest-advising/opia-job-search-toolkit/professionalism-guide/#:~:text=Wear%20business%20attire%20(e.g.%2C%20a,dress%20shoes%20rather%20than%20sneakers.
Here is the arts school- the liberal hippies- this is how they expect their students to dress up for show shifts: https://ofa.fas.harvard.edu/files/ofa/files/student_dress_code.pdf
"Show Shifts: DO WEAR: nice pants or jeans, clean clothes with no rips, holes or tears; button down shirts, sweaters, turtlenecks, collared shirts, polo shirts, dressy short or long sleeved shirts; khakis, dress pants, skirts; Think business casual. DON’T WEAR: t-shirts, t-shirts or shirts with writing or logos, cutoffs, shorts, anything ripped, holey or torn, sleeveless shirts, belly shirts, tank tops, flip flops or sloppy sandals. Formal shows will be marked as "Dress Up" on the Show Shift Calendar which will indicate that it is a no jeans show - so dress pants, khakis, shirts, sweaters, button down shirts, etc. are appropriate, but, obviously, no jeans. For all shifts, including Booth or Phone Shifts: Please be neat, clean and well groomed. Do not wear revealing clothing with shirts with inappropriate content. Please also eschew sweat clothes, pajamas, baseball caps and any attire that may be considered inappropriate. "
Heres a Reddit post on the Harvard subreddit from a few months ago: https://www.reddit.com/r/Harvard/comments/111h94c/average_level_of_dress_on_campus/
"Dress on campus is overall pretty casual. A few deans or central admin folks may wear business formal attire, but most profs dress casual or business casual, and students generally dress casual. You may get a very few older male profs that wear a sport coat.
There will be slightly more formal dress in the law school or the business school, and less formal in FAS or SEAS."
There is a world of difference between business casual / casual and shorts.
It was Tribe actually. I wasn’t offended - a dress code is a dress code. We just came from different cultures. Grow up kid.