I do not intend to be sexist, but I have noticed one trend while applying for internships through college placement cells or independently.
Inspite of having better grades, better moots, better publications etc., I and my fellow make candidates get rejected and women candidates get selected.
And this is not just one off, it has become a recurring theme. Like there being a huge difference between CV's of both the candidates, but 9/10 times a woman candidate gets selected.
Is this reverse sexism or someone may truly explain the rationale behind this?
Maybe they actually work instead of whining on anonymous platforms? Have great CVs independent of you dismissing them? Do not come off like entitled a-holes during interviews?
Mr Flummoxed requested for our support on this forum. You told him that (i) he should 'actually work instead of whining', (ii) he is likely to come off like entitled a-holes during interviews, and (iii) he shouldn't blame his inadequacies on "reverse sexism". Basically, Mr Flummoxed is the problem and he is imagining things.
This is classic gaslighting on online forums.
@Mr Flummoxed - please ignore these comments. Don't ever doubt your capabilities. You don't have any inadequacies. Given that you have better grades, better moots, better publications etc., you are actually working - Kudos.
That would work only if all the ills that he believes have befallen him due to these girls stealing his internships is actually true. And also, unfortunately, saying that he deserves some internships over the other females is entitled, hate to break it to you. Whatever he perceives his value to be does not automatically translate to what employers value him to be. Whining about girls stealing his jobs when they face far more of a hassle with seniors, not being taken to be as intelligent as male counterparts, and having to work that much harder to prove they deserve to be educated at all is childish. Grow up.
This post is 100% spot on. Kian, don't please mark it as contested. I will tell you some true stories from my NLU.
1) The class topper (male) had applied for an internship with a lawyer. To everyone's surprise he rejected him and instead gave an internship to a girl with a much lesser grade (maybe top 20 rank, not more), but who is very beautiful. We later heard that this lawyer has a bad reputation .
2) Another lawyer (male) said he wants only girl interns as "they are more hard working." What nonsense is this? I admit most girls work hard because they do not spend time smoking and chatting idly like us, or playing computer games like us, but certainly not all girls. Many girls are very lazy and don't study at all.
3) Many female lawyers also have a girls-only policy. I have seen that female lawyers are especially strict on male interns and shout at them for the slightest mistake, but girls get away lightly.
2) Another lawyer (male) said he wants only girl interns as "they are more hard working." What nonsense is this? I admit most girls work hard because they do not spend time smoking and chatting idly like us, or playing computer games like us, but certainly not all girls. Many girls are very lazy and don't study at all.
What kind of sexism is this? Get a grip
Quote:
3) Many female lawyers also have a girls-only policy. I have seen that female lawyers are especially strict on male interns and shout at them for the slightest mistake, but girls get away lightly.
Idk why you think so. If anything, many males I know prefer working with female seniors as they're more sensible and reasonable.
1. Grades are not everything. You can be the batch topper with your grades gotten from mugging up/ buttering up the professor, but have no ability to apply said knowledge. Also, who are you to dismiss a female's achievements by saying she got the internship just because of her looks? Even if it was because of her "beauty", the female would be subject to harassment the likes of which you would not even be able to imagine.
So please, before you go acting like the victim, take some time to reflect on your own thoughts. Maybe this view is why female lawyers prefer female interns who would not question if the reason she is in that position is because of her looks. Or for reasons of safety (can personally attest that I have never applied to a male lawyer because of the horror stories I have heard from my female peers, and would prefer a female-centric office. Maybe the senior females feel the same). Just think for once about someone and their concerns apart from your own selfish interests?
How did the senior know she was "very beautiful"? Was there an interview component? Is it possible that she performed better in the interview? Maybe she knew more or was better spoken or maybe she came across as more enthusiastic or less cocky or just less entitled? There are innumerable factors here - even plain stupid luck.
Stop doing a disservice to women who get by blaming their "beauty" for getting opportunities. It's incredibly frustrating for her merit to not be recognised. Women have struggled long and hard to reach wherever they are in this profession and even then the stats show that the hole is gaping... even now in top law firms women are barely 25 percent of the partnership. It's a joke in the judiciary.
Even as women are crossing one impediment after another, random guys like this will come on legally India and wash their batch-politics anonymously in public while in one stroke brushing aside women's merit and hardwork by pegging her success to her appearances. Just awful.
Maybe you can take all this free time you have and work on your grooming since you clearly believe appearances matter. Surely Nykaa has a sale.
Even assuming she was hired for her beauty rather than brains, isn't it is pretty sad for her? Did you think about the kind of internship she will have where her boss chose her based on appearances. Do you think it'll be a safe or comfortable workplace ?
At worst for you - you lose an internship with a creepy senior. At worst for her - she is actually interning with a creepy senior. Thought of that. May be you should be concerned for her rather than jealous of her.
I like to believe that the world is fair, and nobody wants to work with incompetence. You probably lost the battle in nuances. For example, I look favourably on good grades, moots, publications, etc. But any candidate who displays to me that he has worked with right people, has interned with right work items under his belt, etc., is interesting in real life with exposure to life outside law, may be awarded for his/her niftiness and initiative to not stick to traditional ideas.
I am sorry, but I would respect a topper, but that won't be enough to qualitatively qualify as the best. Specially, because I want to bet that you will stay on with the firm for 10 more years.
While I disagree with the fact that there is a gender bias in approving internship applications, but I'll like to share one personal experience here:
My best friend (female) and I applied to a lawyer based in Delhi for an internship on the same date and for the same period. Surprisingly, he replied to my application as "I don't take interns in my office" and on the contrary, approved my friend's application and shared details of his office.
Now, this is not gender bias but indicates the sick mentality that some people, notwithstanding their profession, hold until today.
I've seen [...] HR(s) give preference to CVs which had pictures of candidates for internships. Both of hem would then discuss the pictures and choose to reply or ignore.
This is from a few years back. Things may be different now.
Well If on LinkedIn, there's a post for girls only internships, its empowerment, et al. If its the other way round, There's a chance of some random viral post on LinkedIn saying 'Stop boys only internships', 'Reserve seats for girl interns' etc.
Who else sees this difference? Although both types of internships are fine, but the probability of it being questioned, or challenged in a viral post on LInkedIn, Fb, etc. is more for the latter than the former.
That's because girls, unlike boys, are discriminated against because of their gender throughout their lives in terms of education and career. If you fail to understand that even after a legal education, then there are several reasons why you are not getting those internships. Honestly, what are these law schools teaching their students these days that basic social realities elude their grasp?
I do not intend to be sexist, but I have noticed one trend while applying for internships through college placement cells or independently.
Inspite of having better grades, better moots, better publications etc., I and my fellow make candidates get rejected and women candidates get selected.
And this is not just one off, it has become a recurring theme. Like there being a huge difference between CV's of both the candidates, but 9/10 times a woman candidate gets selected.
Is this reverse sexism or someone may truly explain the rationale behind this?
Thank You.
Don't blame your inadequacies on "reverse sexism"
Mr Flummoxed requested for our support on this forum. You told him that (i) he should 'actually work instead of whining', (ii) he is likely to come off like entitled a-holes during interviews, and (iii) he shouldn't blame his inadequacies on "reverse sexism". Basically, Mr Flummoxed is the problem and he is imagining things.
This is classic gaslighting on online forums.
@Mr Flummoxed - please ignore these comments. Don't ever doubt your capabilities. You don't have any inadequacies. Given that you have better grades, better moots, better publications etc., you are actually working - Kudos.
1) The class topper (male) had applied for an internship with a lawyer. To everyone's surprise he rejected him and instead gave an internship to a girl with a much lesser grade (maybe top 20 rank, not more), but who is very beautiful. We later heard that this lawyer has a bad reputation .
2) Another lawyer (male) said he wants only girl interns as "they are more hard working." What nonsense is this? I admit most girls work hard because they do not spend time smoking and chatting idly like us, or playing computer games like us, but certainly not all girls. Many girls are very lazy and don't study at all.
3) Many female lawyers also have a girls-only policy. I have seen that female lawyers are especially strict on male interns and shout at them for the slightest mistake, but girls get away lightly.
Quote: Idk why you think so. If anything, many males I know prefer working with female seniors as they're more sensible and reasonable.
So please, before you go acting like the victim, take some time to reflect on your own thoughts. Maybe this view is why female lawyers prefer female interns who would not question if the reason she is in that position is because of her looks. Or for reasons of safety (can personally attest that I have never applied to a male lawyer because of the horror stories I have heard from my female peers, and would prefer a female-centric office. Maybe the senior females feel the same). Just think for once about someone and their concerns apart from your own selfish interests?
Stop doing a disservice to women who get by blaming their "beauty" for getting opportunities. It's incredibly frustrating for her merit to not be recognised. Women have struggled long and hard to reach wherever they are in this profession and even then the stats show that the hole is gaping... even now in top law firms women are barely 25 percent of the partnership. It's a joke in the judiciary.
Even as women are crossing one impediment after another, random guys like this will come on legally India and wash their batch-politics anonymously in public while in one stroke brushing aside women's merit and hardwork by pegging her success to her appearances. Just awful.
Maybe you can take all this free time you have and work on your grooming since you clearly believe appearances matter. Surely Nykaa has a sale.
At worst for you - you lose an internship with a creepy senior. At worst for her - she is actually interning with a creepy senior. Thought of that. May be you should be concerned for her rather than jealous of her.
I am sorry, but I would respect a topper, but that won't be enough to qualitatively qualify as the best. Specially, because I want to bet that you will stay on with the firm for 10 more years.
I can only advice self-introspection.
My best friend (female) and I applied to a lawyer based in Delhi for an internship on the same date and for the same period. Surprisingly, he replied to my application as "I don't take interns in my office" and on the contrary, approved my friend's application and shared details of his office.
Now, this is not gender bias but indicates the sick mentality that some people, notwithstanding their profession, hold until today.
Yet, sadly, casual sexism occurs alarmingly often.
Sir, if I could offer you one piece of unsolicited advice, please don't waste your law school years in unnecessary comparison - nothing comes of it.
Claiming you deserve the internship over others of a different gender is sexism.
This is from a few years back. Things may be different now.
If on LinkedIn, there's a post for girls only internships, its empowerment, et al.
If its the other way round,
There's a chance of some random viral post on LinkedIn saying 'Stop boys only internships', 'Reserve seats for girl interns' etc.
Who else sees this difference?
Although both types of internships are fine, but the probability of it being questioned, or challenged in a viral post on LInkedIn, Fb, etc. is more for the latter than the former.